[dipstick] Posted August 9, 2003 Report Share Posted August 9, 2003 Weaponry wise I was thinking of: Cold fusion instead of plasma/sonic. It would work both under and over water, no bonus/penalties. There would be: CF pistolCF rifleCF hand cannonCF Missile launcher - for HWPCF " " - for aircraftCF defensesAdvanced CF defenses!! Then laser stuff would also be modified: Laser pistolL rifleL hand cannonL HWPL cannon - aircraftL defensesHeavy Laser defensesGatling Laser technologyLight Gatling laser - equivalent to rifleHeavy GL - equivalent to hand cannonGL - aircraftGL defenses This is in research order. To compensate - there should be no Fusion ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 9, 2003 Report Share Posted August 9, 2003 (edited) Or what about a civil war in Aqualien country? Part of their forces join you in your fight against the Martians, whom they perceive as the bigger threat, believing they want to eradicate/enslave all earth life forms. And the other part joins the Martians, as they always dreamed of regaining total control over the earth (which they lost at some point to us humans), and now they see an opportunity to reclaim what they believe to be theirs. Edited August 9, 2003 by j'ordos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[dipstick] Posted August 9, 2003 Report Share Posted August 9, 2003 where is aqualien country then...........???????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 9, 2003 Report Share Posted August 9, 2003 Aquatic aliens (aqualien, copyright by Warhamster), so aqualien country would be the bottom of the sea -_- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warhamster Posted August 9, 2003 Report Share Posted August 9, 2003 Under the sea...Unda da sea... I can't remember how the rest of the song goes. I'm sure GG will come up with some interesting theory as to the relationship of the aliens and Aqualiens. If you ask real nice... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[dipstick] Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 Well, I thought I covered that...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[dipstick] Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 Also, I am doing 'Cydonia' for this version of events...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[dipstick] Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 I am trying to give an account of Alien Oppression, but as I have not got my books with me, I can't really do it at the moment. I have done, however, some bits and bobs for your perusal. I hope you enjoy...... Bits_and_bobs.zip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aosar Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 Great quote! Anyway, In the original xcom, the Mutons were psionically connected to the etherials.Hmm, maybe, but what is their relationship in Xenocide? where is aqualien country then...........???????? Well, this article explains where it could be, but also reveals that I remembered the war that Cthulhu had to be between the Great Old Ones and the Flying Polyps. However, the Flying Polyps fought a war with the Elder Things and the Elder Things fought a war with the Great Old Ones, but much later... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikker Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 'That is not dead which can eternal lie,And with strange aeons, even death may die.' great fluff text describing the Ethernals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 I think this is getting out of hand. We are talking about version 2.6e7 here people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[dipstick] Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 AAAAAAAAAHHH, but are we now.... and anyway, where do you think this thread is?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 As long as everyone is aware of that, its fine, but dont expect this all to appear in V1. Alien civil wars, diplomacy, new tech, bio weapons, alien allies... not demanding at all are we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aosar Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 (edited) 'That is not dead which can eternal lie,And with strange aeons, even death may die.' great fluff text describing the Ethernals. Dunno about that, would make the people who know the Mythos rise their eyebrows. They don't have anything in common to Cthulhu, but we can somehow tie them into the Elder Things, would fit too, but their appearance it too different... Maybe the overmind is an Elder Thing... As long as everyone is aware of that, its fine, but dont expect this all to appear in V1. Alien civil wars, diplomacy, new tech, bio weapons, alien allies... not demanding at all are we? Fair enough, but I hope we don't leave these ideas to the wind. IMO what we should do with Xenocide is to start from X-Com 1 and moving on to X-Com 6... Oh! To me Genesis is X-Com 6, Enforcer is horse sh41te in a box that has X-Com printed on it... Edited August 10, 2003 by Aosar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 Right, but lets deal with V1 first. I truly hope that we can get V1 going and then move on to better things. However, we might run out of steam before then. Who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aosar Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 Right, but lets deal with V1 first. Agreed! I truly hope that we can get V1 going and then move on to better things. However, we might run out of steam before then. Who knows. Without hope, what is left? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[dipstick] Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 As long as everyone is aware of that, its fine, but dont expect this all to appear in V1. Alien civil wars, diplomacy, new tech, bio weapons, alien allies... not demanding at all are we? Well, as far as I am concerned, I am trying to get some into v1; not all, but some. Most into v2, and the rest in v99 Although, it has to be said, it does vary considerably from the original, with massive coding, artwork, and other stuff to be done to incorporate this stuff.The only thing we do not need to worry about is CT :: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 What exactly did you have in mind for adding to V1? It would have to be very minor as everyone is always saying that any changes to the original are V1+ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[dipstick] Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 Well, I don't quite know where most of this 'new' stuff arrived from, but I wouldn't mind a new alien side. Seriously, I would like... well, there isn't anything that could be easily added, is there? Damn, you are right again Miceless... Still, I will continue to uncover ideas on the subject though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jim69 Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 (edited) What exactly did you have in mind for adding to V1? It would have to be very minor as everyone is always saying that any changes to the original are V1+If any changes at all. THe only changes that should be made in V1 IMO should be gameplay bugs and glitches, any change to gameplay itself should be left until l8r. IMO of cause. Edit: Misread ur post, u practically said what I just said, so I guess i'm just backign up what u said. Edited August 10, 2003 by Jim69 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[dipstick] Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 I do agree with you actually. As I have not played XCOM 1 I want to see how it was as a game, but I also want to add things - I will have to wait until v2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 :o You havent played Xcom 1!? Why? Uncovering ideas on the subject is fine, just dont expect them in V1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[dipstick] Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 It would be helpful to have a copy of said game before I can play it...!! Also, I am trying to get it to work on PC, but it just doesn't. I am looking at getting a very old PC down, to see if it works on there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus Escariut Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 They see we are under attack, and decide to wait a bit and see who wins. Once it's clear we're gaining the upper hand on the aliens they decide to act now, 'cause we probably ain't going to be weaker later. They don't team up with the others and oppose them as well, but their main target are us humans. i think this is a good idea to work on, they dont attack at first cause they are hoping that the aliens will take care of us for them, and waste their resources with us, so then the martians will be weaker, but when they see us starting to get the upper hand they realize they have to strike soon to try and turn the tides (no pun intended) as far as diplomacy... well ... i think it would only be fair then to let the aliens team up on us then...and if u do get a muton i think his name should be tilk... and he should have a staff ... Aqualiens © Warhamster 2003, should tie in with the lost city of atlantis? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aosar Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 Aqualiens © Warhamster 2003, should tie in with the lost city of atlantis? Hmm, possibly, but we shouldn't abandon R'Lyeh either, since Cthulhu Mythos had a tremendous impact on TFTD... In the Mythos the alien Deep Ones constantly took contact with the humans, such contact might be the reason the Atlantian(or what the heck should they be called) peoples technological advance! But maybe the Atlantians became arrogant and forgotted their alien benefactors, who then teached them humility once and for all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus Escariut Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 In the Mythos the alien Deep Ones constantly took contact with the humans, such contact might be the reason the Atlantian(or what the heck should they be called) peoples technological advance! But maybe the Atlantians became arrogant and forgotted their alien benefactors, who then teached them humility once and for all! better idea!.. the alantians were taught by martians, and the Aqualiens © Warhamster 2003 were the ones that destroyed the atlantians... and that could be a reason they attack us, they see aliens making pacts with some govts and realize that the same thing is happnening so they attack agian... im sure the CTD can expand on that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aosar Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 the alantians were taught by martians, and the Aqualiens © Warhamster 2003 were the ones that destroyed the atlantians... Hey! It all comes to me! The Aqualiens fight the Martians, the Martians are controlled by the Overmind and the Aqualiens are controlled by the "ultimate alien" the Caretaker... Then ofcourse the Overmind can be an Elder Thing, the enemy of Cthulhu who can ofcourse be the Caretaker! This pleases everyone, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 So if the Martian aliens are enemies of the Aqualiens, what are they attacking us humans for? You can't really say we're in the way as the Martians are on Mars and the Aqualiens at the bottom of the Oceans... And resources can just as easy be found on the ocean floor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jim69 Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 I'd prefer the story that they both want our planet, and they are sorta like two little kids squabbling over their favourite toy. Just with big guns. They both want us dead, so they ain't gonna ally with us, but they are getting in each others way of world domination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus Escariut Posted August 10, 2003 Report Share Posted August 10, 2003 So if the Martian aliens are enemies of the Aqualiens, what are they attacking us humans for? You can't really say we're in the way as the Martians are on Mars and the Aqualiens at the bottom of the Oceans... And resources can just as easy be found on the ocean floor because when they arrived they saw these crazy "humans" running around and saw no traces of the Aqualiens © Warhamster 2003 , so they figure, hey no threat here, we just enslave / kill these humans and take this planet... then half way through the war the Aqualiens © Warhamster 2003 , wake up and all thier little toys turn on and thats when the martians realize ... opps. by then its to late for the martians cause they already picked a fight with us, and the Aqualiens © Warhamster 2003 think we are decendants of the atlantians so they try to kill us just for that... :wink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpl. Facehugger Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 That's a good idea J-esus, but it needs the ctd to flesh it out a little bit. I mean, why do the aquatic aliens want to kill the martians? Is there some past history (as someone suggested, or do they simply want the same thing? Anyway, I think that there should be fundamental differences between the two groups. For example, in tftd the underwater bugs powersource (zerbite) was made from gold and, more importantly alien bio material. I think that the underwater aliens would be more organic than the martians (ex: zerg although the Aquaaliens © Warhamster 2003 would use more technology than the zerg.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 O dear. Now we're going to have three sides... Humans, a technologically superior race, and a race relying on organic 'technology'... sounds familiar to anyone? Good thing we don't call 'em Terran, Protoss and Zerg :wink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aosar Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 (edited) the Aqualiens © Warhamster 2003 think we are decendants of the atlantians so they try to kill us just for that... That doesn't make sense, the Aqualiens prolly have same agenda as the Martians, but feel that the Martians are on their claim and fight them for the rights to Earths vaning natural resources... O dear. Now we're going to have three sides... Humans, a technologically superior race, and a race relying on organic 'technology'... sounds familiar to anyone? So, nobody wants to go with Cthulhu then? IMO Cthulhu is better source of inspiration than Starcraft... Well when it comes to millenias old undersea aliens, that is... Edited August 11, 2003 by Aosar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus Escariut Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 The Aqualiens fight the Martians, the Martians are controlled by the Overmind and the Aqualiens are controlled by the "ultimate alien" the Caretaker... Then ofcourse the Overmind can be an Elder Thing, the enemy of Cthulhu who can ofcourse be the Caretaker! personally i liked this idea aosar.... not sure about anyone else Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpl. Facehugger Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 O dear. Now we're going to have three sides... Humans, a technologically superior race, and a race relying on organic 'technology'... sounds familiar to anyone? Good thing we don't call 'em Terran, Protoss and Zerg :wink:Well, j'ordos, The underwater aliens would use some technology (like sonic guns) but would use built in weapons and terrorists more. That was just my idea of a fundamental difference. Come up with others besides the obvious one! anyway, the cthul (sp?) idea seems to be good, but how many people know about the mythos? I don't but that might be just me. Lasty, I would like to see a reason for all of the killing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 O dear. Now we're going to have three sides... Humans, a technologically superior race, and a race relying on organic 'technology'... sounds familiar to anyone? Good thing we don't call 'em Terran, Protoss and Zerg :wink:Well, j'ordos, The underwater aliens would use some technology (like sonic guns) but would use built in weapons and terrorists more. That was just my idea of a fundamental difference. Come up with others besides the obvious one! anyway, the cthul (sp?) idea seems to be good, but how many people know about the mythos? I don't but that might be just me. Lasty, I would like to see a reason for all of the killing... heh, I was just kidding... although the similarities struck me and about the Cthulhu myths, I like it as well, and we can explain those through some x-net entries, like you got in the first two games (alien origins etc.). So if you capture one of those underwater leaders there's this new topic in your library explaining the background and stuff. And who could be better to write that all down than our own Cthulhu-connaisseur Aosar but a reason for the killing?? :o Why do you need a reason to start shooting around? Ok, ok: Thousands of millennia ago, there existed the (then not known as-) Martian Aliens. Then there came the Aqualiens (again, back then not known under that name -_- ), who defeated them and took control over the earth. The Martiens escaped with what remained of their people to the far side of the galaxy, vowing to once regain control over the earth. Now, the Aqualiens have long gone to the bottom of the oceans, after the decline of their civilization for some unknown reason. The Martiens meanwhile have regained much of their former strength and they established a forward base of operations on Mars. Needing more supplies than that barren world can give them, they have to risk to make their presence known to the Aqualiens by raiding the earth's surface. Unfortunately, WE live on that surface, and since they never kindly asked if we could sell them some supplies, the human race takes up arms against the aliens. But all that commotion woke up the hibernating Aqualiens in the oceans, and they're quite in a bad mood, being disturbed from their sleep and seeing their old enemy has returned. So, they need to defend themselves against the invaders, but since they are weakened they are in need of supplies as well, and they search to increase their gene pool to create the ultimate warrior (again, humans seem quite the ideal subject for them). Voilà, 3-way war Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 Actually, jordos does have a point with the Starcraft links. That may or may not be a bad thing, but its kinda true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus Escariut Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 and the reason the Aqualiens © Warhamster 2003 went into a deep sleep was from a meteor that struck earth causing an ice age, they went to the deepest parts of the oceans and took a nap, CTD can work out why they didnt wake up till now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 Maybe they forgot to set their alarm clocks? I know i do. I would post on topic, but my eye lids are already half closed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aosar Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 and the reason the Aqualiens © Warhamster 2003 went into a deep sleep was from a meteor that struck earth causing an ice age, they went to the deepest parts of the oceans and took a nap, CTD can work out why they didnt wake up till now... I can easily handle that, if we take the Cthulhu route. And regarding that... So if you capture one of those underwater leaders there's this new topic in your library explaining the background and stuff. And who could be better to write that all down than our own Cthulhu-connaisseur Aosar I'd be delighted to! I have access to all the relevant pieces of Lovecraft... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[dipstick] Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 *Whistles* HELLO??? Anyone actually looked at my stuff?? I did sort of explain a three way war!!!! Just take a look, and scroll up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 Did anyone hear anything? Could have sworn i just heard some whistling. Oh well, must be the wind. Oh dear, thats two off topic posts. Best make this one look good: Ummm, have we decided what route to take? I think that most people wont know the Cthulhu stuff, so if we use that we have to use it as a background only. That should do. -_- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus Escariut Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 i was thinking that all the mythos stuff would be explained from research branches... this way people that dont know anything about lovecraft can say... hey thats kinda neat... and the ones that do will say hey thats kinda neat... :wink: just something to add a little spice to the game, the idea of atlantis would help since it ties in some unsolved mysteries... i like when a game or movie takes a myth and makes it a reality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fux0r666 Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 In Terror From the Deep, the aquatic aliens were throwbacks to the sectoid race. They were landing party that invaded much ealier. In the first xcom the alien autopsy of the sectoid speaks of webbed feet and hands suggesting an aquatic origin. The alien autopsy of the aquatic sectoids (I forget what they were called) suggested that all of them are clones. The thing about the sectoids is that they alter their own biology through surgery, gene therapy and manipulation. I don't think that two different sectoid races would war because through gene therapy, one sectoid race could easily become the other through surgery and alteration (provided they had the resources to affect such a change to a population and they were so inclined to change them.) And, on the subject of having a simultaneous submarine and land combat, there would need to be too many different offshoots of technologies to do it. You'd need a seperate landing craft, seperate load outs, seperate weapons, detection systems and containment. If you had two different kinds of threats, you could either have TWO threats going on, ie. twice the number of enemies or two alien armies at half strength. Even dealing with the two smaller armies would take a lot more money because you would need one and a half times the equipment and twice the research budget. Sonic weapons rely on the transmission sound waves. It isn't true that sound is a form of electromagnetic radiation. Electromagnetic radiation is comprised of photons of varying energies. Sound waves are compression waves that travel through a media by bumping molecules together. Electomagnetic radiation always travels at the speed of light whereas the speed of the transmission of compression waves is directly proportionate to the density of the medium that's carrying the waves. The speed of sound is much faster underwater, for instance. Sound waves cannot travel through a vaccuum. a wave can be described as a disturbance that travels through a medium, transporting energy from one location to another location. This means that sonic weapons would be useless in space and crap on land since there is much less matter to compress and transmit the energy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jim69 Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 (edited) In Terror From the Deep, the aquatic aliens were throwbacks to the sectoid race. They were landing party that invaded much ealier. In the first xcom the alien autopsy of the sectoid speaks of webbed feet and hands suggesting an aquatic origin. The alien autopsy of the aquatic sectoids (I forget what they were called) suggested that all of them are clones. The thing about the sectoids is that they alter their own biology through surgery, gene therapy and manipulation. I don't think that two different sectoid races would war because through gene therapy, one sectoid race could easily become the other through surgery and alteration (provided they had the resources to affect such a change to a population and they were so inclined to change them.)I don't think they'd really care about issues like that, having compassion towards the same race is a very human trait, usually the only simular thing seen in animals is the compassion towards their own direct family. Edited August 11, 2003 by Jim69 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus Escariut Posted August 11, 2003 Report Share Posted August 11, 2003 i agree with MIJ... AGIAN..., humans are the only ones that seem to care about people despite the diffrences, and even humans fight to the death because of stuff like skin color... or nationality.. or religion... so why cant aliens? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fux0r666 Posted August 12, 2003 Report Share Posted August 12, 2003 Because the it's all the same thing. They are surgically altered to suit whatever task is at hand. They are not born the way they end up; the end up the way they are altered and can be altered again. This is not a creed or racial difference, it's a difference in adaptation... Like a difference in clothing. Moreover, all the aliens are clones, so they are all the same alien. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpl. Facehugger Posted August 12, 2003 Report Share Posted August 12, 2003 But both groups are led by leaders of different races. (Overmind and Giant, Squidmouthed aquatoid) Anyway, for the tech offshoots, you don't really need that many really. You can just say that you have one single fighter/transport sub, say that laser and plasma weapons work underwater, hmm, just put powered armor suits on the aliens, all you need to add is new aliens and alien weapons. And possibly some subs. You can just say that the missiles work on both land and water. (I mean, when a sub launches a cruise missile, the missile goes up through the water until it reaches the surface with a propeller. Lastly, are we going to have real underwater physics? And more importantly FISH? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aosar Posted August 12, 2003 Report Share Posted August 12, 2003 (Overmind and Giant, Squidmouthed aquatoid) That's Cthulhu! You facehugging form of a xenomorph! :: Dunno about plasma and laser working underwater, maybe they can, but certainly not that efficently! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpl. Facehugger Posted August 12, 2003 Report Share Posted August 12, 2003 I didn't mean Cthulhu himself, I meant his tftd impersonator. Which did look rather like an aquatoid version of Cthulhu. And about plasma/laser working underwater I just said that as an example of reducing the workload and not overwhelming the hapless players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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