Vaaish Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 I think the body on that last one is pretty good but the hands and head need to be reworked. IMO the head could be a little flatter and broader, if you can get some referance from real snakes. (pictures will work so no need to get bit up over it ) and maybe trunicate the tail a little Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 (edited) Ok, but what does 'trunicate' mean? Edit: also, I wanted it to look like a snake, but not like any earth snake... Edited August 5, 2003 by j'ordos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demich Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 here is the pic about which i was talking http://republika.pl/demich/yuanti.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red knight Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 How about experimenting with the Lizardman crossing it with this model... I am worried about the movement of this creature, biped character looks like more easier to animate and make them look right.. Drew whats your opinion? On the other hand, the snakeman is pretty heavy armored, this model looks a little weak. GreetingsRed Knight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 I'd say not necessarily, It's scaly hide could be some natural tougher-then-Kevlar armor, or maybe it's grafted with alien alloy... Something like that can be made up with some text, and I don't think we want to make it too big/heavy looking. Of course, that's just me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jim69 Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 The head of the pic RK posted would look great IMO, I also agree that movement is gonna be dodgy, but the peeps seemed to like it that way so I shut up It could work I spose with just the tail pulling it along the floor, but how it stands up like that and walks is beyond me. It is an alien tho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaaish Posted August 5, 2003 Report Share Posted August 5, 2003 Ok, but what does 'trunicate' mean? Edit: also, I wanted it to look like a snake, but not like any earth snake...trunicate means cut off in the basic sense. Just means shorten the tail somewhat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 That would be 'truncate' Vaaish. And jordos, you original snake thing looked like its neck had been run over by a car. :: New versions are much better. I like the idea of it slithering along like a snake. Makes it more alien. Otherwise all our aliens are going to be bipedal human shaped creatures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 It's this, or we make them more Tasoth-like... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 Remind me what a tasoth looks like... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demich Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 miceless:human size, bipedal, yellow reptile :] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 Ah yes, now I remember. I like the idea of it slithering along like a snake. Makes it more alien. Otherwise all our aliens are going to be bipedal human shaped creatures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaaish Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 That would be 'truncate' Vaaish. And jordos, you original snake thing looked like its neck had been run over by a car. :: New versions are much better. I like the idea of it slithering along like a snake. Makes it more alien. Otherwise all our aliens are going to be bipedal human shaped creatures.I guess I did slip in an extra "I" sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jim69 Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 How is the snake gonna move without legs then? Remember they stand upright on the tails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 Same way as a real snake does. Presumably it would have to lower itself down a bit to move, but it could do that and then stand up again when it stopped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 Here's the new Snakeman, I've redone the head to be lower, but it doesn't really show as it's mouth is opened wider, and I've redrawn the claws, still not happy with them, but getting better. The tail is shorter too, but I haven't gotten round yet in creating a heavier, stronger looking version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jim69 Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 (edited) Same way as a real snake does. Presumably it would have to lower itself down a bit to move, but it could do that and then stand up again when it stopped.Snakes have 2 wriggle their whole body 2 move, it simply wouldn't work 4 them 2 just wriggle the part on the ground, they would have 2 lie down 2 move and take up 2 squares in front of itself, then stand 2 fire, which is why someone tried having the arm as long as the body in a concept ( can't remember who, check last page ) so that it could drag itself by it's knuckles. Unless u can think of a better way of movement I just don't think it is possible 4 it 2 move stood up like that. Edit: It does look good tho. Edited August 6, 2003 by Jim69 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt. Boxershorts Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 In the original, it used the lower body as a single foot, sort of like a snail. We don't have to worry about being super realistic (no one complained in the orginal, after all). As long as the movement animation looks okay, no one will question it. -The Captain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 (edited) It does look good tho.Exactly. This is the biggest point. It looks good. Its nice to have a non bipedal alien, and we can stretch the rules of movement a little. Also, it could move by having two points of contact (poc) on the ground. Not sure how to explain this.... Will attempt a diagram. Imagine the following 'V's as curves in its body....VV - starts like this...V.V - moves its first poc forward..VV. - then moves its second one forward.V.V. - then first ...etc etc EDIT: Damn, not only did Cpt Boxershorts beat me to it, he explained it better too. Edited August 6, 2003 by miceless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jim69 Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 In the original, it used the lower body as a single foot, sort of like a snail. We don't have to worry about being super realistic (no one complained in the orginal, after all). As long as the movement animation looks okay, no one will question it. -The CaptainHmm, the animation is gonna be the tricky part tho. So, how IS it gonna move? If it does move like a snail then it's gonna be VERY slow coz snails use some dodgy slime sh!t as lube and sorta give little wriggles to move along the slime. Noone complained in the original coz the graphics were so bad that u couldn't tell HOW it moved. In 3D it's a different issue. If there is a good way of doing movement that doesn't involve it hopping along or just floating along the ground then I would be more than happy as I like the current design. I just can't c a decent way of doin it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt. Boxershorts Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 from what I remember, the animation went something like this:head/torso leaned forwardabdomen extended'hips' and tail slide forward under head/torsoTry sitting in an office chair (with wheels) and pull yourself forward using this movement. -The Captain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 Well, i dont know about anyone else but I just had fun pretending to be a snakeman on my office chair. :: I think thats about what I was describing isnt it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 I was thinking it could move like a rattlesnake, more or less. They move sideways by curling their body and then stretching it. So our Snakemen could stand up, and curl their tail up, so it's next to it's body (somewhat like in the pic). Then they press down on the tip of their tail (so no lubricant, they would need friction... hmmm, maybe they should stay clear of ice battlescapes ), and stretch their tail again, but at the same time rotating their support point. If what I'm sayig here makes any sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aosar Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 I think it should *strange shudder* slither like a *another shudder* snake... After all, it is a snakeman... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 Maybe we should give them a new attack too: the poison bite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aosar Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 The snakemen look more like, that when they bite you, you lose a limb! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 (edited) Those teeth are for swallowing their prey, after it's paralysed by the injected poison. And after snakemen and medikits are researched there's a new option on the medikit available: cure posion Edited August 6, 2003 by j'ordos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aosar Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 And after snakemen and medikits are researched there's a new option on the medikit available: cure posion When will it have; Cure Light Wounds? :: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jim69 Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 I think it should *strange shudder* slither like a *another shudder* snake... After all, it is a snakeman...So, on the floor then?I was thiniking that it's gonna cause some major headaches when goin thru doors and near a wall coz it will just go straight thru it. But I think I've said enough, I really will shut up now. Whoever modells it is gonna have 2 work out how it's gonna move, and good luck 2 ya son :: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aosar Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 I was thiniking that it's gonna cause some major headaches when goin thru doors and near a wall coz it will just go straight thru it. ? What do you mean? If it stays within "the box," there should be no trouble... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 (edited) Here's another version, a bit more armored, and a bit bigger. But maybe this is beginning to go over the top, 'cause in my opinion it doesn't really improve. Oh well... Edited August 6, 2003 by j'ordos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jim69 Posted August 6, 2003 Report Share Posted August 6, 2003 I was thiniking that it's gonna cause some major headaches when goin thru doors and near a wall coz it will just go straight thru it. ? What do you mean? If it stays within "the box," there should be no trouble... Really, after this post I will shut up, honest I mean this. If it moves like a snake, then it needs 2 lie down 2 do that, it can't do it on a little bit of tail It needs to spread it's body weight evenly throughout it's body and do that slither thing along the floor snakes do. When it lies down there is no way in heck it's gonna be under 1m long. The only other options are hopping on it's tail, or using that slug idea. I don't like any of the above. How is the animator gonna do any of these 3 without it looking lame? I don't think it's possible. In X-Com 1 it just moved, like it hovered across the screen, but noone noticed coz of the poor graphics of the day. They will in 3D. Well, I recon I said plenty on the matter, so I'll let others decide what they think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaaish Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 Here's another version, a bit more armored, and a bit bigger. But maybe this is beginning to go over the top, 'cause in my opinion it doesn't really improve. Oh well...Hmmm.. It overall looks pretty good but I'm a little concerned with that head. He looks more like hes been scared half to death than he looks scary. try basing the head off of a cobra or rattlesnake. maybe even through in characteristics of an aligator or croc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaaish Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 I was thiniking that it's gonna cause some major headaches when goin thru doors and near a wall coz it will just go straight thru it. ? What do you mean? If it stays within "the box," there should be no trouble... Really, after this post I will shut up, honest I mean this. If it moves like a snake, then it needs 2 lie down 2 do that, it can't do it on a little bit of tail It needs to spread it's body weight evenly throughout it's body and do that slither thing along the floor snakes do. When it lies down there is no way in heck it's gonna be under 1m long. The only other options are hopping on it's tail, or using that slug idea. I don't like any of the above. How is the animator gonna do any of these 3 without it looking lame? I don't think it's possible. In X-Com 1 it just moved, like it hovered across the screen, but noone noticed coz of the poor graphics of the day. They will in 3D. Well, I recon I said plenty on the matter, so I'll let others decide what they think. When it moves we can have it lean forward so the weight is dispursed evenly, then when it stops moving or attacks it rears up like a cobra. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 Yeah, I still think that the head needs work. As for the movement, i think that it will be able to walk ok. We can make it do a modified version of the slug thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demich Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 Here are some references with snake's head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 (edited) Nice. I think I'll try some of that 'venomous' look. Is it my imagination or does that one really look mad and the other one is looking happy? Edited August 7, 2003 by j'ordos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 Thats a good reference. The first one does look kinda mad, but the second one definitely looks like he is up to something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 Better like this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puasonen Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 (edited) snakeman was much fatter in the original.. You know, give that a lot more meat and let's see what it looks like? Also he needs some alien alloy armor a little bit, looks cooler. EDIT:And btw, the last one is the best so far.. Edited August 7, 2003 by Nyyperoid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 Those blue scales are alien alloy armor... and I already increased it's size, but I can try and increase it some more though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 Much better head, but can you close its jaw a bit. I get the impression it has permanently dislocated it. Perhaps also consider making its mouth go back less far? Or maybe not. Also, i think its front armor should stop at the same place as the rear one as it may encounter a bit of chaffing when it tries to move along with the armor on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaaish Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 from the side it looks alit better with that head, but can we ge a quick top view sketch of the head since that is where most of the form will be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 (edited) An inherent snake characteristic is it's ability to dislocate it's jaw, so it can open up it's mouth very wide to swallow prey larger than itself.Edit: well maybe not all snakes, but I'm sure there are some with this ability.but here, I made it a bit smaller, and dropped the lower part of the armor.As for the top view of the head, made a quicky of what I imagined as well. Edited August 7, 2003 by j'ordos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 I realise they can do that, but can you give us a shot where it doesnt look like its trying to eat its hand? Also, would it stand so hunched? Would the head be lower than the top of its neck? Dunno about that. As for the top down view, can you round it off at the front? I think its too square. I suppose that could just be the armor, but I think it should be rounded. Maybe also make it a bit wider at the front? And the tail armor looks better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jim69 Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 I realise they can do that, but can you give us a shot where it doesnt look like its trying to eat its hand? Also, would it stand so hunched? Would the head be lower than the top of its neck? Dunno about that. As for the top down view, can you round it off at the front? I think its too square. I suppose that could just be the armor, but I think it should be rounded. Maybe also make it a bit wider at the front? And the tail armor looks better.Dunno, what does a cobra look like when it rears it's head? I remember it look sh!t scary if u the 1 standing in front of it, so it should be like that. I think what is pictured is almost like what they do but I can't remember Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j'ordos Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 (edited) I thought so too, but just to please Miceless here's one with it's head more upright and more closed jaw.Edit: now I think of it, I should add a forked tongue Edited August 7, 2003 by j'ordos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 As far as a normal pose goes, the jaw looks better to me. As for the higher neck, im not sure. It looks better in some way, but still wrong. Lets see what some other people think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jim69 Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 Me thinks that it look good. I like the sleek look of the head, it actually does look better with the head raised like that. Dunno what miceless is on about tho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miceless Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 Maybe the neck is too long? Can you try shortening the neck a little? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts