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CTD - Repeater Cannon


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#1 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 01 January 2004 - 02:52 PM

At long last, here is the autocannon CTD that I promised. (I know it is kind of late, but here goes! :))
If there is anything wrong with it, please tell me.

It is pasted on the bottom as a RTF file, but here it is for all those who don't like to download attachments:

The [Autocannon] is a versatile weapon capable of firing .50 caliber High Explosive, Armor Piercing, or Incendiary ammunition at a high rate of fire. Unfortunately, the AC-110 is extremely heavy, and thus should only be carried by the strongest of soldiers. The Armor Piercing rounds are your standard ammunition and should be used in most circumstances. High Explosive tipped rounds should not be used in confined spaces or while in close proximity to your target. Incendiary rounds should be used primarily to smoke out an enemy from his hiding space.


"The AC-110 is the first automatic .50 caliber weapon that can be carried by a single soldier. First used in the gulf reformation wars, the [Autocannon] quickly gained infamy due to its ungodly effectiveness. The AC-110 proved its versatility when troops used it to smoke enemy soldiers out of tunnels, provide light anti-tank capacity, and mow down hoards of armored enemies. The [Autocannon] has served with distinction in militaries the world over ever since." -James' weapons, Volume VI


The AC-110 is a fully automatic and man-portable .50 caliber assault gun. This weapon can fire .50 cal shells of three different types, Armor Piercing/General Purpose, High Explosive tipped, and Incendiary tipped rounds each with varying uses. This weapon uses magazines of 14 rounds per clip to minimize weight as much as possible. Unfortunately, the magazines are still incredibly heavy compared to standard 5.56mm rifle magazines. Due to their weight, it is recommended that a single soldier carry no more than two AC-110 clips. The [Autocannon] itself is extremely heavy, in spite of the fact that it is primarily made of high-density plastic. The AC-110 has a high rate of fire, which combined with its reasonable accuracy makes it a powerful weapon.

Armor Piercing Rounds: These .50caliber bullets are similar to miniature SABOT rounds, designed to provide significant penetration of all known materials. They are the bread and butter of an AC-110 gunner.

High Explosive Rounds: These bullets are essentially high quality HEAT rounds in a smaller, easier to transport package. When this round hits anything, it will explode with enough power to punch through 10cm of composite armor. This makes it incredibly useful for the infantryman on the move, who encounters a tank or similar target.

Incendiary rounds are composed of a soft, hollow tip that, when breached, releases enough phosphorus to light the immediate area on fire. This fire burns slightly hotter than normal, and is excellent for smoking out an entrenched enemy (as was proven on rebel targets in the Gulf Reformation Wars.)

Each magazine of HE or IC rounds is carefully sealed to prevent premature detonation.

"Hey, Lenny read this: ?Use of BFG?s new sealed magazine has improved safety margins by over fifty percent!? So now, the gun will only explode every three shots instead of every other shot! Too bad it?s too late for poor Richardson" -Cpl. Alex Dupont

"[Rookie] Richardson was killed in a training accident while loading his [Autocannon]. Investigation is ongoing into the cause of his death" - X-Corps Liability report

Edit: stupid .rtf file won't attach properly! So I guess you are stuck with a .doc for the time being.

Attached Files


Edited by Cpl. Facehugger, 01 January 2004 - 02:53 PM.

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#2 mikker

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Posted 01 January 2004 - 03:55 PM

the fluff text can be better.

"remember kids: You cannot load an AC-110 with rockets. And you cannot fire it. Look, i will here try to put five rockets down into the magazine....hey...they went in....now...lets fire it!" ~Last words by [Rookie] Richardson before the "auto rocket failure" accident.

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#3 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 01 January 2004 - 04:08 PM

I agree. My fluff text sucked. :)
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#4 Robo Dojo 58

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Posted 01 January 2004 - 10:07 PM

I have a few ideas on the make of the autocannon rounds

Armor Piercing Rounds: These .50 caliber bullets are similar in design to a shape charge. The round explodes at impact, directing an extremely powerful explosive charge in a 5 degree arc in front of the bullet, powerful enough to punch through 10cm of composite armor. This allows the round to be fired at a slower velocity while still being effective, providing easier control of the weapon, especially in full auto mode. These rounds are best suited for dealing with heavy weapons, and light infantry supression in close quarters.

High Explosive Rounds: These bullets are essentially high quality HEAT rounds in a smaller, easier to transport package. When this round hits anything, it will explode with enough power render every man within 10 feet unconsious. This makes it incredibly useful for heavy infantry supression, although is ineffective against a tank's heavy armor. Exercise extreme caution when using these rounds indoors, and in full auto mode.

A .5 caliber bullet is half an inch round... so each bullet would probably weigh around a pound. In a 14 round clip, that adds up pretty fast! :D
--Edit: change "10 feet" as necessary--

Edited by Robo Dojo 58, 01 January 2004 - 10:08 PM.

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#5 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 01 January 2004 - 10:23 PM

I like your changes, they are very good. They'll be included in the next update.

Anyway, in the original game, autocannon ammo was incredibly heavy, only my uber 100 stregnth guy could carry more than two without being slowed down.
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#6 Breunor

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Posted 01 January 2004 - 10:42 PM

IIRC armor piercing rounds are also known as sabbot or HEAT rounds, they are both variations of armor piercing rounds. A short description of both can be found at http://www.theavonla...r/heatsabot.htm

I don't know enough about the ammo to say whether your wording of HE and AP are overlapping or not, what do you think?

You might also mention that the cannon has multiple barrels (3 I think for the last concept made) that allow the rate of fire without overheating. It's not going to be a Vulcan minigun, but more of a modern looking cousin.

#7 tzuchan

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Posted 02 January 2004 - 12:58 AM

Hmm...

When this round hits anything, it will explode with enough power render every man within 10 feet unconsious.


Sounds like I don't even need to research the small launcher anymore... :devillaugh:
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#8 Robo Dojo 58

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Posted 02 January 2004 - 08:16 AM

Sounds like I don't even need to research the small launcher anymore... 

Oops, forgot about that.
High Explosive Rounds: These bullets are essentially high quality HEAT rounds in a smaller, easier to transport package. When this round hits anything, it will explode with enough power to severely injure anyone within a 6 ft.* radius. This makes it incredibly useful for heavy infantry supression, although is ineffective against a tank's heavy armor. Exercise extreme caution when using these rounds indoors, and in full auto mode.

Yeah, my AP round idea is essentialy a HEAT round also, just directed through armor. I'm saving my other idea (heheh..) for the heavy cannon.

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Secondly: This organisation takes too much money to run. Weapon shipments will come from Siberia from now on. Costly maintenance is to be cut on all facilities. That includes venting.
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#9 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 02 January 2004 - 10:13 AM

I was specifically trying to avoid the barrel issue, because I didn't get a straight answer on the model we are using. All I got was "Yeah, we're probably going to be using BlackAce's three barreled model." If that is what we are using, I can always add in the extra three barrels in the next revision.
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#10 Gutter Monkey

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Posted 09 January 2004 - 09:26 PM

Sounds good, I really like the discriptions of the different kinds of ammo. I never used auto cannons or heavy cannons beacuse I could never figure out what the different types of ammo did.

#11 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 10 January 2004 - 12:11 PM

Autocannons are one of the most versatile weapons in the game! AP is like a pumped up rifle bullet, HE is like a mini grenade, and IC sets stuff on fire! :)

Next revision will probably come sometime this weekend.
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#12 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 15 February 2004 - 09:58 PM

Sometime this weekend...right...

Anyway, I've pretty much finished the autocannon CTD, but I would like someone to come up with a cool fluff text for it! My current one feels a bit forced, and it isn't very funny. :(
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#13 MagicAndy

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Posted 16 February 2004 - 05:10 AM

when the call goes out 'bout the little green men,
when the call goes out 'bout the little green men
just gimme mah boots and mah one-ten
just gimme mah boots and mah one-ten
'cause any damn alien facin' me
'cause any damn alien facin' me
is gonna suck some IN-CEN-DA-RY!!"
is gonna suck some IN-CEN-DA-RY!!

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#14 Anthraxus

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Posted 16 February 2004 - 08:01 AM

Nice Andy. But a bit long. How 'bout something like:

"As long as you can pick it up the 110 is just about one of the deadliest things on the field. I only tried to use it once, and after I set my boots on fire I decided to leave for the stronger grunts in the unit." - Squaddie Sean Phillips
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#15 MagicAndy

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Posted 16 February 2004 - 07:57 PM

"Mah AC-110's is what ah love...
Cause the AP rounds, they the do the job...
gonna bust in the U..F..O front door...
gonna nail some greys to the spaceship floor..
sound off.. 1 .. 2... "

Edited by MagicAndy, 16 February 2004 - 07:58 PM.


#16 RustedSoul

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Posted 16 February 2004 - 09:29 PM

"HEH.. laying down a barrage of autocannon fire, is like asking an alien to run through the shower without getting wet." or somthing

#17 Magstar

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Posted 25 February 2004 - 12:18 PM

"When I first came out of bootcamp, Sarge gave me the best advice I've ever heard. He said: 'Son, don't ever hit on a girl who carries a one-ten. It'd take less effort to rip off both your harms than it takes to lift one of those.'"

Edited by Magstar, 25 February 2004 - 12:19 PM.


#18 Danny252

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Posted 25 February 2004 - 01:41 PM

"There were, like, 6 greys with plasma rifles all aimed at me. I then got out ma one-ten and they disappeared within, like, one sixth of a second." Sergant Bob Newman, Autocannoneer.
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#19 Breunor

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Posted 25 February 2004 - 02:00 PM

Nice fluff, especially like MaginAndy's boot camp marching song.

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#20 Deimos

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Posted 25 February 2004 - 05:34 PM

Heh "Time to let ol' painless outta the bag"

#21 MagicAndy

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Posted 25 February 2004 - 06:50 PM

we've done incendary, and piercing:


Scrawled on a mess table:

"There once a rookie called Wells,
who dropped some one-ten HE shells
and when the smoke cleared,
he had dissapeared,
but they found these legs in Brazil...."

Edited by MagicAndy, 25 February 2004 - 06:50 PM.


#22 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 06 July 2004 - 04:49 PM

Okay. Here's the absolute final. It's got the fluff text, and some slight modifications.

Attached Files


Edited by Cpl. Facehugger, 06 July 2004 - 04:49 PM.

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#23 Astyanax

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Posted 25 January 2005 - 12:47 PM

red text = additions
orange text = deletions
blue text = comments

[AUTOCANNON]
X-Net://Pegasus.net/Weapons/[Autocannon]


The [Autocannon] is a versatile weapon capable of firing .50 caliber High Explosive, Armor Piercing, or Incendiary ammunition at a high rate of fire. Unfortunately, the [AC-110] is extremely heavy, and thus should only be carried by the strongest of soldiers. The Armor Piercing rounds are your our? standard ammunition and should be used in most circumstances. High Explosive-tipped rounds should not be used in confined spaces or while in close proximity to your target. Incendiary rounds should be used primarily to smoke out an enemy from his its Changed to allow for women and Aliens. hiding space.

“The [AC-110] is the first automatic .50 caliber weapon that can be carried by a single soldier. First used in the gGulf rReformation wWars, the [Autocannon] quickly gained infamy due to its ungodly effectiveness in what type of combat situations (i.e. urban, close quarter)?  Specify. The [AC-110] proved its versatility when troops used it to smoke enemy soldiers out of tunnels, provide light anti-tank capacity, and mow down hoards of armored enemies. The [Autocannon] has served with distinction in militaries the world over ever since.” James’ wWeapons, Volume VI.

The [AC-110] is a fully automatic and man-portable .50 caliber assault gun. This weapon can fire .50 cal shells of three different types, Armor Piercing/General Purpose, High Explosive tipped, and Incendiary tipped rounds, each with varying uses.  This weapon uses magazines of 14 rounds per clip Redundant. to minimize weight as much as possible. Unfortunately, the magazines are still incredibly heavy compared to standard 5.56mm rifle magazines. Due to their weight, it is recommended that a single soldier carry no more than two [AC-110] clips. The [Autocannon] itself is extremely heavy, in spite of the fact that it is primarily made of high-density plastic. The [AC-110] has a high rate of fire, which combined with its reasonable accuracy makes it a powerful weapon.

Armor Piercing (AP) Rounds: These .50 caliber bullets are similar to miniature SABOT rounds, designed to provide significant penetration of all known materials. They are the bread and butter of an [AC-110] gunner.

High Explosive (HE) Rounds: These bullets are essentially high quality HEAT rounds in a smaller, easier to transport package. When this round hits anything, it will explode with enough power to punch through 10 centimeters of composite Suggest changing this word so as not to be confused with Alien Composites. armor. This makes it incredibly useful for the infantryman on the move, who encounters a tank or similar target.

Incendiary (IC) rRounds: These Changed to remain consistent with the previous two entries. are composed of a soft, hollow tip that, when breached, releases enough phosphorus If they have a hollow tip, where does the phosphorus come from?  Specify. to light the immediate area on fire. This fire burns slightly hotter than normal, and is excellent for smoking out an entrenched enemy (as was proven on rebel targets in the Gulf Reformation Wars.)

Each magazine of HE or IC rounds is carefully sealed to prevent premature detonation.

"When I first came out of boot, Sarge gave me the best advice I've ever heard. He said,: ‘Son, don't ever hit on a girl who carries a one-ten. It'd take less effort to rip off both your arms than it takes to lift one of those.’ " –Corporal Hermann Magstar

"Mah [AC-110]’s one-ten? is what ah love...
Cause the AP rounds, they the do the job...
gonna bust in the U..F..O front door...
gonna nail some gGreys to the spaceship floor..
sound off... 1... 2... " –Seargeant Andrew “Magic Andy” Fitzpatrick

Not bad! Maybe include a bit about its historical development or previous design to flesh out its background? Perhaps something like: the AC-110 is man-portable version of the platform-mounted AC-10 developed for (anti-tank?) purposes...

-Asty

Edited by Astyanax, 25 January 2005 - 01:32 PM.

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#24 Blehm 98

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Posted 30 January 2005 - 10:49 AM

okay, already proofed version, look at this one:
Autocannon

The [Autocannon] is a versatile weapon capable of firing .50 caliber High Explosive, Armor Piercing, or Incendiary ammunition at a high rate of fire. Unfortunately, the AC-110 is extremely heavy, and thus should only be carried by the strongest of soldiers. The Armor Piercing rounds are your standard ammunition and should be used in most circumstances. High Explosive tipped rounds should not be used in confined spaces or while in close proximity to your target. Incendiary rounds should be used primarily to smoke out an enemy from his hiding space.


"The AC-110 is the first automatic .50 caliber weapon that can be carried by a single soldier. First used in the gulf reformation wars, the [Autocannon] quickly gained infamy due to its ungodly effectiveness. The AC-110 proved its versatility when troops used it to smoke enemy soldiers out of tunnels, provide light anti-tank capacity, and mow down hoards of armored enemies. The [Autocannon] has served with distinction in militaries the world over ever since." -James' weapons, Volume VI


The AC-110 is a fully automatic and man-portable .50 caliber heavy assault gun. This weapon can fire .50 cal shells of three different types: Armor Piercing/General Purpose, High Explosive tipped, and Incendiary tipped rounds each with varying uses. This weapon uses magazines of 14 rounds per clip to minimize weight as much as possible. Unfortunately, the magazines are still incredibly heavy compared to standard 5.56mm rifle magazines. Due to their weight, it is recommended that a single soldier carry no more than two AC-110 clips. The [Autocannon] itself is extremely heavy, in spite of the fact that it is primarily made of high-density plastic. The AC-110 has a high rate of fire, which combined with its reasonable accuracy makes it a powerful weapon.

Armor Piercing Rounds: These are the standard issue bullets for the Autocannon, and are the simplest and cheapest rounds for the weapon. They are a Depleted-Uranium Discarding-Sabot round, designed for maximum penetration of the target. These rounds often tend to be the most accurate rounds too.

High Explosive Rounds: These bullets are essentially high quality HEAT rounds in a smaller, easier to transport package. When this round hits anything, it will explode with enough power to punch through 10cm of composite armor. This makes it incredibly useful for the infantryman on the move, who encounters a tank or similar target.

Incendiary rounds are composed of a soft, hollow tip that, when breached, releases enough phosphorus to light the immediate area on fire. This fire burns slightly hotter than normal, and is excellent for smoking out an entrenched enemy (as was proven on rebel targets in the Gulf Reformation Wars.)

Each magazine of HE or IC rounds is carefully sealed to prevent premature detonation. "Hey, Lenny read this: Use of an Autocannon's new sealed magazine has improved safety margins by over fifty percent!? So now, the gun will only explode every three shots instead of every other shot! Too bad it’s too late for poor Richardson" -Cpl. Alex Dupont

"[Rookie] Richardson was killed in a training accident while loading his [Autocannon]. Investigation is ongoing into the cause of his death" - X-Corps Liability report
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#25 Guest_Azrael_*

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Posted 02 February 2005 - 06:39 PM

AUTO-RIFLE
X-Net://Pegasus.net/Weapons/Auto-Rifle

The Auto-Rifle is a very versatile weapon, capable of firing .50 caliber High Explosive (HE), Armor Piercing (AP), or Incendiary (IC) ammunition at a high Rate of Fire (ROF). Unfortunately, the AR-110 is extremely heavy and thus should only be carried by the physically strongest of soldiers. The AP rounds are our standard ammunition and should be used in most circumstances. HE rounds should not be used in confined spaces or in close proximity to the target. Incendiary rounds should be used primarily to smoke out an enemy from its hiding space.

Changed designation from AC-110 which I guess stands for AutoCannon to AR-110, which should stand for Auto-Rifle.

“The AR-110 is the first automatic .50 caliber weapon that can be carried by a single soldier. First used in the Gulf Reformation Wars, the Auto-Rifle quickly gained infamy due to its ungodly effectiveness in almost all combat conditions, being able to use AP rounds in close quarters and switch to HE or IC rounds for long range shots or area-spread desired effects. The Auto-Rifle proved its versatility when troops used it to smoke enemy soldiers out of tunnels, provide light anti-tank capacity, and mow down entire enemy squads in one hit. The Auto-Rifle has served with distinction in militaries the world over ever since.” James’ Weapons, Volume VI.

The AR-110 Auto-Rifle is a fully automatic and man-portable assault gun. This weapon uses magazines of 14 rounds to minimize weight as much as possible. Unfortunately, the magazines are still incredibly heavy compared to standard 5.56mm rifle magazines. Due to their weight, it is recommended that a single soldier carries no more than two AR-110 clips. The Auto-Rifle itself is extremely heavy, in spite of the fact that it is primarily made of high-density plastic. The weapon’s high ROF, combined with its reasonable accuracy, makes it a powerful weapon.

It’s the third and fourth time it mentions it’s .50 caliber, deleted as it’s very known by now. Also, in the first paragraph it already states that it can fire AP, HE, and IC, no need to repeat. High Rate of Fire is also repeated.

Armor Piercing (AP) Rounds: These .50 caliber bullets are similar to miniature SABOT rounds, designed to provide significant penetration of all known materials. They are the bread and butter of an AC-110 gunner.

High Explosive (HE) Rounds: These bullets are essentially high quality HEAT rounds in a smaller, easier to transport package. When this round hits anything, it will explode with enough power to punch through 10 centimeters of composite armor. This makes it incredibly useful for the infantryman on the move, who encounters a tank or similar target.

Why is HEAT in caps? Is it an acronym? I think composite armor is the name of an actual armor, so I don’t know if we can change it.

Incendiary (IC) Rounds: These are composed of a soft, hollow tip containing phosphor that, when breached, releases enough to light the immediate area on fire. This fire burns slightly hotter than normal, and is excellent for smoking out an entrenched enemy (as was proven on rebel targets in the Gulf Reformation Wars)

It’s the third time that I see “smoking out”, we need a synonym, but I can’t think of any now

Each magazine of HE or IC rounds is carefully sealed to prevent premature detonation.

"When I first came out of boot, Sarge gave me the best advice I've ever heard. He said: ‘Son, don't ever hit on a girl who carries a one-ten. It'd take less effort to rip off both your arms than it takes to lift one of those.’ "
–Corporal Hermann Magstar

"Mah AR-110’s is what I love...
Cause the AP rounds, they the do the job...
gonna bust in the U.F.O. front door...
gonna nail some Greys to the spaceship floor..
sound off... 1... 2... " –Seargeant Andrew “Magic Andy” Fitzpatrick

Edited by Azrael, 02 February 2005 - 06:46 PM.


#26 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 02 February 2005 - 09:14 PM

I shall also rewrite this one for flow. But to answer some of your questions, yes HEAT is an acronym. It stands for High Explosive Anti Tank. Composite armor is also a *real* armor, but it isn't very descriptive. I could have used chobbham or reactive armor, which *is* very descriptive.

Also, where did the Auto-Rifle come from?
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#27 Astyanax

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Posted 02 February 2005 - 09:52 PM

Keep up the good work, soldier! :) I'm learning quite a bit from reading these entries.

Oops, I let one spelling mistake get through. :( In the last line, it's Sergeant Andrew “Magic Andy” Fitzpatrick. Sorry!

Edited by Astyanax, 02 February 2005 - 09:54 PM.

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#28 j'ordos

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Posted 03 February 2005 - 07:10 AM

Not to nitpick, but HEAT isn't really an explosive warhead (well, it is, but not in the way it is used ingame here, as anti-personnel High Explosive)
HEAT stands for High Explosive Anti Tank, and so is actually more like an AP round (like stated in the CT actually), except that instead of relying on kinetic energy to break through armor like an AP round, a HEAT round upon impact projects a powerful explosive blast forward to penetrate the armor (so it does not really 'explode' like HE and hence isn't effective against infantry)
I opened this topic again, as I feel the HE ammo part should be changed...

edit:

Cause the AP rounds, they the do the job

I think that 'the' in bold can go :)

edit2: hmm, so facehugger said what HEAT is too, sorry I didn't see that. I still think it should be changed to something else though.

Edited by j'ordos, 03 February 2005 - 07:15 AM.

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#29 Guest_Azrael_*

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Posted 04 February 2005 - 08:54 PM

Moved to Active, as sole exception, to be rewritten.

#30 mikker

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 03:52 PM

we should also try and find out what fluff is the best.

Pool, anyone?

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#31 Moriarty

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Posted 07 March 2005 - 07:06 AM

I love the "don't ever hit on a girl who carries a one-ten" fluff. That sounds very much like something you would encounter in the military. :D

the other fluff... it's supposed to be a song, isn't it? although I don't get the rhythm. that one needs to be re-written if it's used, I think.




...btw, I think the IC rounds should be filled with a "phosphorus-based incendiary gel" instead of just "phosphorus". as a simple element it is remarkably stable. it would probably just create a phosphorus-dust cloud, making the aliens sneeze. :P
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#32 Guest_Azrael_*

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Posted 07 March 2005 - 01:22 PM

Three fluffs is excessive, two maximum I think is most suitable, the first one I like, besides all of the Cpl's weapon text have quote from James' weapons :D, and the one of the girl. The song one is not bad, but I prefer the other two :)

#33 Guest_Azrael_*

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Posted 24 October 2005 - 09:44 AM

Small update, any opinions?
----------
REPEATER CANNON
X-Net://Pegasus.net/Weapons/Repeater Cannon

The Repeater Cannon is a very versatile weapon, capable of firing .50 caliber High Explosive (HE), Armor Piercing (AP), or Incendiary (IC) ammunition at a high Rate of Fire (ROF). Unfortunately, the RC-110 is extremely heavy and thus should only be carried by the physically strongest of soldiers. The AP rounds are standard ammunition and should be used in most circumstances. HE rounds should not be used in confined spaces or in close proximity to the target. Incendiary rounds should be used primarily to smoke out an enemy from its hiding space.

The AR-110 Repeater Cannon is a fully automatic and man-portable assault gun. This weapon uses magazines of 14 rounds to minimize weight as much as possible. Unfortunately, the magazines are still incredibly heavy compared to standard 5.56mm rifle magazines. The Repeater Cannon itself is extremely heavy, in spite of the fact that it is primarily made of high-density plastic. Its high ROF, combined with its reasonable accuracy, makes it a powerful weapon.

Armor Piercing (AP) Rounds: These .50 caliber bullets are similar to miniature SABOT rounds, designed to provide significant penetration of all known materials. They are the bread and butter of an AC-110 gunner.

High Explosive (HE) Rounds: These bullets are essentially high quality HEAT rounds in a smaller, easier to transport package. When this round hits anything, it will explode with enough power to punch through 10 centimeters of composite armor. This makes it incredibly useful for the infantryman on the move, who encounters a tank or similar target.

Incendiary (IC) Rounds: These are composed of a soft, hollow tip containing phosphor that, when breached, releases enough to light the immediate area on fire. This fire burns slightly hotter than normal, and is excellent for attacking entrenched enemies.

Each magazine of HE or IC rounds is carefully sealed to prevent premature detonation.

"When I first came out of boot, Sarge gave me the best advice I've ever heard. He said: ‘Son, don't ever hit on a girl who carries a one-ten. It'd take less effort to rip off both your arms than it takes to lift one of those.’ "
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#34 Blehm 98

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Posted 24 October 2005 - 11:24 AM

As a heat round though, the HE would not project a circular area of effect, but a jet of plasma going forward.

Also, HEAT rounds are no longer used, Discarding SABOT rounds have the exact same effect but are even more lethal, so HE round should be small grenade-like shots
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#35 Moriarty

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Posted 24 October 2005 - 01:19 PM

I agree, this should not be explained as a HEAT round. HEAT is a precision weapon for penetrating armor, while our HE ammo is basically an area-of-effect thing.

I propose the following text:

High Explosive (HE) Rounds: These bullets are essentially high quality explosives in a small package. When this round hits anything, it will explode with enough power to cause considerable damage to anything in the immediate vicinity. This makes it incredibly useful in situations where collateral damage is of minor concern, and gives a good chance of incapacitating targets even without hitting them directly.


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#36 fux0r666

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Posted 24 October 2005 - 04:02 PM

Since we're doing this whole cross-department participation...

There are a couple of issues that need resolving.

Firstly, 'repeater' refers to a mechanism that feeds itself from some kind of magazine but is manually operated. For instance, most shotguns have a pump action repeater mechanism. Saying that the weapon is a repeater and fully automatic is a contradiction in terms.

Secondly, .50 bmg is much too small a round to carry effective HE loads. The weapon concept itself is based on the xm-20 project and its high velocity, (I think low-pressure,) 20mm grenades. Anythink between 20mm and 30mm would be plausible, though, especially 25mm. 25mm is an under-used calibre. That said, there is no person on earth that could hold a snub-nosed weapon that fires .50bmg at a 'high rate of fire' and remain standing.

HEAT rounds do explode, and, in fact, that have quite a blast, but they don't have any anti-personelle fragmentation effects. I must emphasize that they are quite explosive. A common development for personelle carried ordinance is to have a HEAT round with the circumpherence wrapped in a coiled, notched wire that shatters into antipersonelle fragments on detonation. This results in a round that is effective against light armoured vehicles and personelle called a HEDP (High Explosive Dual Purpose) round. Also note that although it's called 'HEAT', meaning Anti-Tank, no has/recoil operated design could be made to fire a warhead large enough to scratch a tank and still be held and fired by a man.

Here I go an angry brother gonna make his move
But can I buck him in the city so I never lose?
See I'm a get him in the crowd with a couple heavies
And lay the barrel to the ground, hold the gat steady
And now I'm ready for my adversary, talk is cheap
I'm looking for a way to make a plan gonna keep it neat
So don't be telling me to get the non-violent spirit
'cause when I'm violent is the only time the devils hear it
'cause all I want to see is m****f***ing brains hanging


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#37 Guest_Azrael_*

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Posted 24 October 2005 - 04:16 PM

Unfortunately the name has been voted, and the contradiction really means nothing to us people who have no idea on weapons, I don't see the contradiction myself.
About your other corrections, well, you quite lost me there, hopefully we can get someone among our weapon lovers to write this one based on your comments... or not :)

#38 Moriarty

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Posted 24 October 2005 - 04:24 PM

Hi fuxor, glad you dropped by :)

I didn't know about the repeater thing - or rather, i never thought about it. are you 100% certain that "repeater" always has to be manually operated? if so, we should probably name the "VAHC" (Variable Ammo Heavy Cannon = Heavy Cannon) "repeater", since it has the lower firing rate.

also, could you explain again what .50 caliber means? how small is that?

and finally, I think we should not make our HE rounds as complicated as a HEDP. because if we explain it as that, we would have to adjust the in-game workings to fit the explanation (different effectiveness versus armored/unarmored targets, asymmetrical blast zone, you name it) :)
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#39 fux0r666

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Posted 24 October 2005 - 05:56 PM

.50 is .5 inches = 12.7mm. .50bmg is the browing machinegun calibre used by the M82 barret and other NATO .50 calibre sniper systems, and is 12.7 x 99mm.

While the definition of a repeater is not strictly limited to manually operated action, the term is antiquated and is redundant when replied to an automatic action. Colliqually, it is a contradiction. The rest is up to you, I just have not ever heard anyone say, or seen anyone write that a machinegun was a repeater. It's usually 'gas blowback automatic' or 'recoil operated automatic,' rather than 'gas operated, automatic repeater.' Repeater is sort of implied when you say, 'autoloader,' 'semi-automatic' or 'fully automatic,' as it must be loaded somehow or else it would not be able to repeat.

The standard round for the m203 grenade launcher is the M443 40mm (edit: HEDP) grenade. We're not constucting a fire-arms simulator, but I think the text should be correct. The concept is a grenade launcher. I don't think that you need to include HEDP, but I think that the text should allude to that fact edit: that it is a grenade launcher or something similar). The correct term for an antipersonelle round is Apers, AP meaning Armour Piercing.

Any weapon system can fire varied ammo.. even the m16 has several types of ammo that can be fired... revolvers, shotgun, rifles, you name it. If you are open to changing the name I would say something about variable roles.

Grenade launchers/cannons/heavy weapons aren't assault weapons so much as they are support weapons. They're used to give support to riflemen. Maybe this bit of information would help out.

There are some edits up there because sometimes I forget that other people can't peer into my head and know what I'm thinking, apparently.

The point of listing the m443 is that it is standard and it's a HEDP round.

The point of talking about the fire-arms simulator was that the text can make sense and be in more depth that the game so long as it's logical. You wouldn't really have to make an asymmetical blast for a HEDP round, as long as it had some armour piercing and anti-personel effect. I think that having it loaded with Apers fragmenting HE ammunition, and antimaterial incendiary ammunition (and whatever that other ammunition is in the game, was it armour piercing?) should be sufficient.

Edited by fux0r666, 24 October 2005 - 10:30 PM.


Here I go an angry brother gonna make his move
But can I buck him in the city so I never lose?
See I'm a get him in the crowd with a couple heavies
And lay the barrel to the ground, hold the gat steady
And now I'm ready for my adversary, talk is cheap
I'm looking for a way to make a plan gonna keep it neat
So don't be telling me to get the non-violent spirit
'cause when I'm violent is the only time the devils hear it
'cause all I want to see is m****f***ing brains hanging


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#40 Moriarty

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Posted 25 October 2005 - 01:06 AM

the three ammo types for the VARC:

AP (Armor Piercing) - right now, a SABOT round

HE (High Explosive) - what we have been talking about

IN (Incendiary) - kind of self-explanatory :)


since any kind of HEDP would be more effective against armored targets than the AP round (and therefore probably making it obsolete), I think we should stick with a grenade-like idea for the HE round. don't you think so?
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#41 Blehm 98

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Posted 25 October 2005 - 11:13 AM

I agree with fuxor, .5 caliber is massive for an anti-personel rifle, but all gattling guns are at least 25mm. Of course, this isn't a gatling gun, but .5 caliber is too small for any explosive of reasonable size
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#42 mikker

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Posted 25 October 2005 - 01:02 PM

I agree with fuxor, .5 caliber is massive for an anti-personel rifle, but all gattling guns are at least 25mm.  Of course, this isn't a gatling gun, but .5 caliber is too small for any explosive of reasonable size

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


We're dealing with aliens here, not humans. X-corps didn't know what they were up ageanst; so they chooce the biggest and baddest bullets.
As for the bullets being too small..... well, if it's millitary grade 2014 explosives we are talking about, then yes. It'll be enough. Think of the satchel packs. They arn't all that big either.

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#43 Blehm 98

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Posted 26 October 2005 - 10:57 AM

We also don't put sticks of C4 (or some equivalent) into half inch diameter bullets
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#44 mikker

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Posted 27 October 2005 - 02:31 AM

We also don't put sticks of C4 (or some equivalent) into half inch diameter bullets

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C4 needs detonation from a type of trigger. The explsives in the bullets need a pressure/impact to detonate it. You can't compare the type of explsives, I was only pointing out that we're advanced in the future then now. This is a sci-fi game.

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#45 fux0r666

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Posted 27 October 2005 - 06:09 AM

Gatting guns come in any size. There is even a 5.56 microgun. 5.56mm bullets = .223.

The autocannon will not be a gattling gun.

You can fill a bullet with as much explosive as you want but you still need a fuse and a contact point or time detonator. Fully half of a 40mm grenade is fuse. An RDX explosive like C-4 was used in HESH rounds in world war 2. I think they have developed far more specialized explosives since then. The fact remains, though, that the .50bmg round is too small to have any useful amount of HE. If you fill a round with a substance that is less dense than lead, you reduce its armour penetrating capabilities. These small amounts of explosives would go off like firecrackers.. so you've got a round with no HE potential and no AP potential.

Why are you stuck on using such a arbitrary round like the .50cal in this weapon anyways? .50 cal is a machinegun round. It's not even in the 'cannon' category of rounds.

I think you should stick with a grenade like idea for all of these rounds, considering the weapon is a grenade launcher and bares much more than a casual resemblance to a grenade launcher system that is in development, currently.

Edited by fux0r666, 27 October 2005 - 06:12 AM.


Here I go an angry brother gonna make his move
But can I buck him in the city so I never lose?
See I'm a get him in the crowd with a couple heavies
And lay the barrel to the ground, hold the gat steady
And now I'm ready for my adversary, talk is cheap
I'm looking for a way to make a plan gonna keep it neat
So don't be telling me to get the non-violent spirit
'cause when I'm violent is the only time the devils hear it
'cause all I want to see is m****f***ing brains hanging


Posted Image

#46 Blehm 98

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Posted 27 October 2005 - 11:12 AM

i agree again, i forgot to mention that - i have heard of tiny miniguns before

but overall, .5 caliber is too small for an explosive, and isn't big enough for a cannon anyway

The heavy cannon in the original fired what looked like 40-50mm rounds, and the autocannon maybe 25-30mm - comparing them to the the size of other objects

the autocannons shots should have a caliber of maybe 1.5 or 2.0, or perhaps more than that. I'm sure that is plenty large enough for a decent sized explosive
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#47 fux0r666

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Posted 27 October 2005 - 11:21 AM

1.5 cm calibre is 15mm which is barely larger than .50 which is 12.7mm calibre.

Here I go an angry brother gonna make his move
But can I buck him in the city so I never lose?
See I'm a get him in the crowd with a couple heavies
And lay the barrel to the ground, hold the gat steady
And now I'm ready for my adversary, talk is cheap
I'm looking for a way to make a plan gonna keep it neat
So don't be telling me to get the non-violent spirit
'cause when I'm violent is the only time the devils hear it
'cause all I want to see is m****f***ing brains hanging


Posted Image

#48 Blehm 98

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Posted 28 October 2005 - 10:22 AM

sorry, caliber in America is in inches, i think 2.4cm:1inch i think

sorry, i should have specified that
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#49 fux0r666

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Posted 29 October 2005 - 01:13 AM

1.5 inches is like 60mm... that's a mortar sized shell. I think that's a little excessive. Search online for the xm25, xm109 or the OICW grenade launcher component to get a clearer idea of the weapon system. It fires 20mm high velocity grenades semi-automatically. I think the analogy is kind of a no brainer.

I stand corrected on the point about assault vs. support weapons. Apparently the xm25 is an assault weapon somehow... for accurately blasting tangos out of their foxholes and such. There you go ;)

Edited by fux0r666, 29 October 2005 - 01:25 AM.


Here I go an angry brother gonna make his move
But can I buck him in the city so I never lose?
See I'm a get him in the crowd with a couple heavies
And lay the barrel to the ground, hold the gat steady
And now I'm ready for my adversary, talk is cheap
I'm looking for a way to make a plan gonna keep it neat
So don't be telling me to get the non-violent spirit
'cause when I'm violent is the only time the devils hear it
'cause all I want to see is m****f***ing brains hanging


Posted Image

#50 Blehm 98

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Posted 29 October 2005 - 08:18 AM

Yes, i was talking with my dad, he said about one of the new grenade launchers has a 20mm barrel which will shoot just about anything you put in it...

i think 20mm is plenty big - so i think the general view is that it should be 20-25mm, not 12.7mm as stated in the text :)
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