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#1 Pocus

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Posted 11 November 2004 - 01:44 AM

Hi there,

I rediscovered this excellent game after some years, I have read the FAQ, but there is still many questions unanswered:

1. what xcom items you cant produce by yourself? eg, can you produces hovercar, plasma guns, etc. ?
2. what happens after many weeks of play? the alien are declared automatically winners, do they send hundreds of crafts at once, etc. ?
3. what is the purpose of making a faction bankrupt? They seems to still have a normal weaponry each time they got raided, can still make raid, etc.
4. is it not gamey to raid 10 time in a row, the same building, and fetch each time goodies (CoS and psythingies...). It halt my suspension of disbelief, but I need money otoh ...
5. should I refrain using my wounded agents if I want them to recover faster?
6. I would like to have my base raided, how can i do that? :rolleyes:
7. does a limit exists on how many agents and vehicles you can have?
8. if I raze a building, and prevent the repair shuttles to reconstruct it, can it still function for the faction owning it?

thanks you much!

#2 NKF

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Posted 11 November 2004 - 02:46 AM

1. Anything that you can buy cannot be manufactured. That's pretty much it, really. Also, you cannot manufacture some alien weapons like the brainsucker launcher and the entropy launcher (sad really, considering how potent a weapon this is whenever you're feeling extra nasty).

2. Nope. Depends on what state the aliens are in. If their armada of ships are in very healthy numbers but the aliens are being kept at a stalemate with their activities in the city, then sometimes they'll initiate the Apocalypse mission, which basically just means they'll send in a bunch of capital ships and a few escorts and just blow a few pre-selected targets up. But it doesn't matter how long you play. I played for several game years and kept the aliens in check (i.e. blew all the ships up in the alien dimension) and the game just kept going.

3. Bankrupting a company? None whatsoever except to lower that number in the ufopaedia. Companies will still attack each other (and you if you're an enemy), rebuild buildings, etc. And as noted, the buildings will be full of equipment and guards every time you attack them.

4. Indeed. Keep in mind that you don't want to raise your score too much from repeated raids in the early game or else you'll make the aliens rush their technology (technology is score triggered).

5. Exactly. Agents will also only use the training facilities if they're at 100% health. Very important for the strength stat as it only raises through the training facility. Apart from that, yes, keep your human and hybrid agents healthy by rotating them out of combat after they're wounded. Androids on the other hand can just go on and on given they've got moderate health remaining.

6. Events in the city every day are random. The main prerequisite is to be in very hostile relations with an organisation. Multiple hostile organisations might increase the probability of an attack.

7. Yes. Although I can't remember what they were. You also have a limit to how many vehicles you can buy off the market at any given time (or perhaps week), but I don't know about produced vehicles.

8. Yes. Although you won't be able to raid it if you've destroyed the access chutes (or the building is sufficiently damaged to prevent you from attacking it until some repairs are done). Repairs are always done at the end of the week (or was it day? Week seems more like it), so it won't matter what you do with the repair vehicles.

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#3 Pocus

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Posted 11 November 2004 - 02:55 AM

ok, thanks a lot, it clears things quite a bit.

I'm still not completely understanding some things:

you say I cant manufacture things I can buy, so does it means I wont be able to manufacture those nice plasma guns ammo?

you say that every alien ship destroyed is really counted in the "alien fleet pool"? Does they build new ones, how many do they have?

about healing, a wounded agent cannot heal, but a FAQ says that healing only start "after a good night rest", so does it means I should not use my wounded agent for anything if I want him to recover faster, or does it dont really matter (for example I have a sarge with only an handful of points lost, can I use him in a mission?).

new question : accuracy increase with kills, or shot fired? (firing a machinegun against a wall would be silly...)
if I kill civilian, does it counts as damages against the faction? Perhaps I should stun them so they dont make a blip on my motion scanner? good idea or not?

thanks

Edited by Pocus, 11 November 2004 - 02:58 AM.


#4 NKF

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Posted 11 November 2004 - 03:30 AM

Nope, unfortunately, you cannot manufacture the ammo. On the other hand, you can still steal the ammo from raids. (Hints: Elerium pods - those little round thingies you pick up sometimes - convert into ammo for ship plasma cannons whenever you bring them home).


Yes, the aliens have a certain number of alien ships in their fleet at any given time. They build new ships at the end of every week. (That is to say, the moment the clock ticks over to 12.00am on a Sunday night).

If you've wiped them all out in the alien dimension (and you should once you are able to), they appear to build 4 or 5 ships every week. (That is to say, 2 bombers and the 2 capital ships. Or, the 2 capital ships and 3 of those type 1 scout UFOs).

As for healing, like quite a lot of things (like changes to the agent/tech hire pool and training), healing is only done at the end of the day(Clock goes to 12.00am). So if there's a med-bay at the base (and the soldier is at the base), the soldier heals a bit.

Yes, wounded soldiers can go out to battles (as necessary), but remember that the more health they lose, the more downtime needed to heal them back up to 100%. Which means wasted training for each day in the med-bay.

The game still automatically removes wounded soldiers from a ship whenever it returns from a mission.

---

As for accuracy, well, I haven't looked too much into the experience mechanics of Apocalypse, but assuming it roughly follows its two predecessors (and it seems to. To an extent, only attacks against enemy units count (i.e. not civilians but neutral guards are counted as enemy units). The more hits, the better the chance of getting an accuracy raise after the mission. Like the first two games in the series, kills don't count, hits do.

- NKF

Edited by NKF, 11 November 2004 - 03:31 AM.

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#5 Pocus

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Posted 11 November 2004 - 04:35 AM

thanks NKF! as for stunning or killing civilians, is it bad for your friendly status versus an org?


I'm rather amazed by the deepness of this game: that for example a team of alien beamed down is really moving thru the builings of a city to infect them is rather realistic, or that the aliens really have a fleet, and are not throwing generated-on-the-fly ships when they comes from their gates... really i dont understand why many said that xcom apoc was a failure compared to the others two.

about modding, is it possible to change the numbers of aliens found in missions?

#6 NKF

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Posted 11 November 2004 - 04:49 AM

Oh it has it's ups and downs, like every other game.

Well it's actually okay to stun neutral guards and civilians and it won't do a thing to your score. It's only the damage to the building (and death of their guards, if any) that they're really concerned about. Seriously, even if it's one of their own guards that do damage to the building (and you were only passing throuh, to, say, steal some equipment), they'll blame it on you.

As for killing civilians... heh, who knows. I don't think it affects relations as much as shooting a guard or damaging the building. But just so you know, there's no need to stun or kill civilians. The aliens do not attack civilians. The aliens will gladly attack you. They may even attack the guards (when 'raid'ing an infested building ) if they are on hostile terms with each other - although I've never seen this personally. But as for the civilians, they mainly die in the crossfire.

- NKF

Edited by NKF, 11 November 2004 - 04:51 AM.

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#7 Jonaleth Irenicus

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Posted 11 November 2004 - 07:51 AM

I have massacred civilians in tactical missions from time to time (It WASN'T my fault!!! They got in between the cross fire. Why are you looking at me like that?!?!?)

The first time I did it I said "shuckeroonies I killed so many people the organisation surely hates me now". When I finished the mission, I checked organisations tab and nothing had happened.

So either it has no effect or something minimal compared to other things (killing guards and blowing the place up...)
Passenger ship terror site, first turn, I open the door of my Triton, there is a Tasoth up on the next floor (his back is facing the screen so I don't know what weapon he has).

One of my guys fire at him, hit, he reaction fires with Thermal Shock Launcher. The whole crew stunned. Mission over.

#8 Tsereve

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Posted 12 November 2004 - 11:41 AM

Probably does stuff to your score.
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#9 alok

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Posted 12 November 2004 - 04:31 PM

About accuracy, it increases by the number of shots fired against anyone, even your soldiers. Try to fire many times one Marsec M4000 against an armored soldier and see the results after. Well, you can use a Megapol Stun Grapple with a disruptor shield. No problem at all.

#10 Tsereve

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Posted 12 November 2004 - 04:36 PM

Hence, the infamous stun raid.
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#11 Pocus

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Posted 13 November 2004 - 02:11 AM

well, I try to not play gamey, and without any reloads. Thats why I hate to know that its possible to raid 10 times in 5 mn the same building. :(

some more questions:

1 - any ammo clip partially used disapears after a mission? What happen if I partially use an AP clip, and switch to a HE clip before the end of mission. Will the AP clip in my inventory disapears?

2 - is it possible to have a stealth approach, like hiding in the corner of a room, waiting to shoot at the back of an alien? Or do they cheat and know where you are?

3 - is it possible to have allied guards helping you when protecting/defending a structure from alien/faction raids?

4 - do I really need to study corpses of aliens, if I have a live one captured?

5 - what is the purpose of keeping more than one type of each alien in a contingency area?

6 - in case of being raided yourself, are the agents wearing what you equipped them with, or is it randomised (pretending they are not wearing the stuff planned for a mission).

#12 NKF

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Posted 13 November 2004 - 02:31 AM

1 - No, you won't lose a partial clip. In fact, the game will refill the partial clip from the remaining bullets in storage. See, the game stores bullets as data rather than the number of clips.

Ammo Tip: You can stack bullets into a single clip in the battlescape. It compacts the bullets, but it doesn't remove the bullets. Say you combine 5 megapol lawpistol clips into 1. It'll still weigh as much as 5 clips, but will take up less space. If removed in the cityscape, it'll separate into its individual remaining clips. To do this, just drag the clip that you want to empty into the target clip and drop it on top of it. The clip will return to its previous slot but will show that it only has 0 bullets remaining while the other will have an ammo count that's the sum of the two clips. You can make this dud clip vanish by throwing it away or loading it in the gun. (Note: The combined clip will only load the necessary number of clips into its corresponding gun). Great for large rockets. I wouldn't look at this as a cheat, because the weight compensates for the extra space.

2 - In a way - as long as the alien hasn't seen you. Jumping out and stabbing an alien in the back with a power sword is a strategy I've employed many times before. Save your game and run a few experimental missions just to see if it's possible.

3 - Unfortunately no, guards only spawn on raids, not investigations (although if the building is infested, aliens will appear in either mode).

4 - Yes (except the overspawn - not to be confused with the megaspawn). Well, only if you want Toxin-B, Toxin-C and the anti-alien gas rockets and grenades. However, they are not compulsory for winning the game. Note: Your scientists automatically put a corpse back into containment after they've interrogated a live alien, so you needn't keep any corpses and live aliens of the same type if you're strapped for space.

5 - None, really. You only need one type of each alien that you have not researched yet.

6- You wear what you're equipped with. You even get one chance to re-arm your soldiers before the mission starts.

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#13 alok

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Posted 13 November 2004 - 03:47 AM

Now that you mentioned an overspawn, I have my own newb question..., do you know how can I have one to attack me? I've never seen them, I always play superhuman, but even so, they never appear to attack me! What's the problem? At least one time I would like to see one. Do I lose something on research tree without them? As far as I'm concerned no, but there's no problem in asking...

#14 NKF

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Posted 13 November 2004 - 04:37 AM

Well, it's hard to say when one will appear. But it's generally late in the game once they've rolled out the capital ships, the battleship and mothership. Overspawn are only transported in them in any case.

One important prerequisite is that the alien fleet still has a couple of their capital ships, and a few escorts (fast attack ships, escort or even bombers, usually) flying about in the alien dimension. If you like to wipe them out, like I do, you'll rarely see them.

Most of the time you have to rely on pure luck, as events that can happen on any given day are random.

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#15 Pocus

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Posted 13 November 2004 - 06:14 AM

thanks a lot! great infos.

another one, how armor reduce damage? I read that for vehicles its, armor/6, but for soldiers? same formulae?

Just tried a stealth raid with my best soldier (a mere sarge with (56 hp and 55 acuracy!), I started sneaky, and ended defending myself against cultists, killing 6 but dying in the end! ;)

oh by the way, are psiclones (dont remember exactly the name) always in the same place for a given cultist building?

other topic, I switched to a SD turbo on an hovercar, and I must say that the improvement was rather limited compared to the standard reactor, is it buggy?

is it true that the less items left in stock, the more can be recreated by the various factions, but proposed at a higher price (basically if I buy each week all hoverbikes, will I get more to be sold next week, compared to leaving them stockpiling).

Edited by Pocus, 13 November 2004 - 06:18 AM.


#16 NKF

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Posted 13 November 2004 - 03:02 PM

Let's see:

For the cityscape, I really haven't a clue how armour works. But for the battlescape, it's basically counts as damage reduction. (Random damage level - armour). Simple as that, really. I think the game also has a damage resistance/multiplier modifier like the original games where you can take more damage or less from certain damage types. For example, you almost always take tons of damage from devestator cannons even in full X-Com disrupter armour, but you can shave off a lot of damage from dimension missile damage (which does tons more damage than the disrupters according to the ufopaedia) in full disrupter armour.

As for psi-clones:

Well, all buildings have item spawn spots. Items will always get created in these areas, but what type of item is semi-random. So a psiclone may be lying on the floor in the hallway between the two large doors in one case, in another it might be on an altar, or it could be in the room under the altar, etc. These spawn spots are all over the place. You just need to learn to recognise where they are and head there whenever you raid to see what's there.

Just a note: The gangs and the cult have psiclones. Other companies store elerium pods instead. Pisclones sell for more, but the pods gets turned into ammo for vehicle plasma weapons.

As for the engines:

Not necessarily. The game has quite a lot of your ships slow down a bit so that they're not going at 100% their listed speed, so the difference in speed isn't always apparent. You can get your vehicle up to full speed in manual control though.

As for market stocks:

Well, the game stocks items at random every week, so the levels of items at the end of the week probably won't have too much of an impact on stock levels. I think they may try to keep item levels up to a certain quota. For example, look at the power swords. You'll almost never see the market flooded with these, and you'll only get 0 - 2 or probably even 3 at a time, while a megapol stun grenade often gets generated in fair quantities quantities.

The prices only raise or lower in sale/purchase price depending on how many you've bought or sold in the past. If you don't do anything, the prices will always stay stable. So if you buy a lot of things, the prices will go up. If you flood the market with something the prices will drop. Note: Price drops only occur after a purchase, so if you plan on reaping the most money out of a sale, such as say sell a ton of Devestator cannons, hoard it up for a few weeks, say collect up to 100 cannons, and then sell everything off in one go. The selling price will drop a bit, but you'll have reaped a considerable amount of money.

There are a few items that don't change in price. Namely, the psiclone and X-Com hybrid aircraft, which will always sell for twice their build cost.

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#17 Jonaleth Irenicus

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Posted 13 November 2004 - 05:07 PM

*braces himself as reality strains to keep itself intact while correcting NKF on an issue.

I think psiclones do go down in price if you sell quite a big number of them.

The reason X-Com manufactured craft (or any craft, literally speaking) does not go down in sale price is because you can never actually sell more than one craft.

OK that didn't make any sense. Let me explain.

You know how lamely the game names your vehicles, like Valkyre-1 or Annihilator-15. When you are selling a craft, say your Valkyre-1, you are not selling a Valkyre, you are selling a Valkyre-1 (which is quite annoying, since when you produce vehicles in mass quantities for profit, you have to sell them one by one).

Since there are no other Valkyre-1s around, and since you can't sell more than one Valkyre-1, the price never goes down.
Passenger ship terror site, first turn, I open the door of my Triton, there is a Tasoth up on the next floor (his back is facing the screen so I don't know what weapon he has).

One of my guys fire at him, hit, he reaction fires with Thermal Shock Launcher. The whole crew stunned. Mission over.

#18 NKF

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Posted 13 November 2004 - 07:34 PM

Unfortunately, the same does not apply to the Stormdog-2 through Stormdog-N's that I keep selling off for cash. Their sale prices go up and their resale prices go down. Compared against the Explorers I build and sell (I use them too), their prices alway stay the same. I think it was $22,000 for an Explorer, and the selling price is always $44,000. Or something like that in any case.

As for psiclones, I often hoard them and sell tons of them in bulk, and the resale prices always seem to stay the same. Can't say the same for other equipment though.

But that's just what I've seen so far.

- NKF

Edited by NKF, 13 November 2004 - 07:36 PM.

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#19 Pocus

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Posted 14 November 2004 - 08:05 AM

thanks!

- does it really serves a purpose to destroy cars from hostile factions? I dont think it weakens them, and you dont get points from killing them. So apart from wasting ammos, I dont see.

- so about this bankruptcy feature, as someone the impression that a broken faction is less well equipped or has less loots when being raided?

- I have been agreably surprised by the existence of sneaky tactics which works (I enjoyed a raid where I stood an agent over a door, killing passing guards each time eg). I watched something today: I managed to sneak past a group of guards, who were looking in another direction, by moving with reactors... fine. Then one of my men landed, and started to run instead... then the guards turned toward me!

My question: can it be that actions are associated with a noise parameter, and that by running my agent made enough noises to scramble the guards. Perhaps its an effect of my imagination, but this would be rather cool!

Edited by Pocus, 14 November 2004 - 08:06 AM.


#20 j'ordos

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Posted 14 November 2004 - 10:20 AM

thanks!

- does it really serves a purpose to destroy cars from hostile factions? I dont think it weakens them, and you dont get points from killing them. So apart from wasting ammos, I dont see.

- so about this bankruptcy feature, as someone the impression that a broken faction is less well equipped or has less loots when being raided?

- I have been agreably surprised by the existence of sneaky tactics which works (I enjoyed a raid where I stood an agent over a door, killing passing guards each time eg). I watched something today: I managed to sneak past a group of guards, who were looking in another direction, by moving with reactors... fine. Then one of my men landed, and started to run instead... then the guards turned toward me!

My question: can it be that actions are associated with a noise parameter, and that by running my agent made enough noises to scramble the guards. Perhaps its an effect of my imagination, but this would be rather cool!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


I suppose destroying their vehicles costs them money, but, as NKF already pointed out, it has no effect. I sometimes do it anyway though :naughty: , although if you miss, you could well damage the city, so, in general you shouldn't bother with them.

Never saw them getting weaker by multiple raids, i sometimes get the impression they actually send in reinforcements when they see you attack the same building over and over :)

Dunno about the noises...
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#21 NKF

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Posted 14 November 2004 - 10:07 PM

Well, I like to destroy enemy cars just to vent my frustration or to show off my overwhelmingly superior toys (Hey, a annihilator blasting the heck out of a construction truck with three missle defence guns is fun! Well, a bit over the top, but still fun!). But no, it serves no purpose, and any damage done to the roads ends up annoying Transtellar.

As for bankruptcy, as mentioned before, no effect whatsoever.

As for the guards, well, the AI tends to be ... well, overly random. Ever watch the civilians? They run about like headless chickens. Well, mainly because they have no particular task at hand, but they still run about like headless chickens. Same goes for still-neutral guards in raids.

I don't think the game's advanced enough to have a sound radius (would've made it cool though!). As I said, the AI is a bit random. So my guess is that the AI just decided to have the guard make a sweep of the area at that moment in time (apart from playing Pass the Parcel with live munitions - which can be somewhat hilarious when done with proximity mines).

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#22 Pocus

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Posted 16 November 2004 - 01:46 AM

thanks for all the answers

#23 Robo Dojo 58

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Posted 20 November 2004 - 09:50 AM

For the cityscape, I really haven't a clue how armour works.

Craft armor is simple damage reduction. The more, the merrier.

Flying craft have 6 separate armor zones. The areas are probably top/bottom/front/back/left/right, not necessarily in that order. Each armor plate has its own defense value, and it will reduce every bullet's damage by that amount. The front plate typically has the thickest armor, and either the bottom or the rear has the weakest armor.

Try giving only one or two plates a ridiculously high armor value. Your craft will take normal damage from the shots that hit the unmodded armor, but it will be completely immune to shots that hit the uber armor.

You'll only notice the difference in armor zones with really weak shots. The strong alien tech is so much more powerful than the armor, that you'll probably never see the difference in a few damage points.

Ship armor does not ever lose its strength.

Edited by Robo Dojo 58, 20 November 2004 - 09:57 AM.

Posted Image Haha! I'm now the Supreme Commander of X-COM. Time to kiss Earth goodbye.

My first order of business: Homeless people make cheap rookies, and are great at opening UFO doors. Heck, they're so cheap, I'm going to replace all personel with them!
Secondly: This organisation takes too much money to run. Weapon shipments will come from Siberia from now on. Costly maintenance is to be cut on all facilities. That includes venting.
Thirdly: We have a new colonel. His name is Facehugger, he loves aliens, and I want you all to treat him with respect.
Lastly: I'll be in my condo on an undisclosed island, if you need me. Good day.

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#24 Exo2000

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Posted 20 November 2004 - 09:20 PM

[quote name='Robo Dojo 58' date='Nov 20 2004, 04:50 PM']
[quote]Ship armor does not ever lose its strength.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[/quote]

Don't experiment too much though... Repair Bays can only usually handle 1 ship at a time.

And a word of warning;

It is completely possible for 2-3 Phoenix 'cars and 2-4 Hoverbikes to take down an unmodded Retaliator with 800 Shields added to it's armour.

Just proof that back/under armour is far weaker than front/side/top.
Posted Image