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#1 Denevive

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Posted 23 June 2003 - 10:12 AM

Hey all-

I've gone ahead an wrote a rough draft of the Elerium 115 entry. At this time I am considering it very rough, so feel free to comment. I'm quite sure that this will be changed, as I worked on this before the Elerium 115 thread occured, and I have not read it yet. :unsure: Anyway, here it is:


Elerium 115

For some time, scientists in the field of particle physics have been bombarding high-density atoms to produce synthetic super-heavy elements. The highest density atom found in nature is Uranium 238, and initial attempts to create new elements through particle acceleration or “atom smashing”, have failed. This seeming “sea of instability” has kept scientists for keeping synthetic atoms from decaying at an exponential rate. However, many particle physicists have theorized an “island of stability” where synthetic atoms could occur. Elerium 115, the source of alien power and propulsion, seems to be an example of an element occurring on this “island of stability”.

Elerium 115, so named due to its apparent derivation from Ununpentium (theorized periodic table number 115), is an apparently stable super heavy element. The most important aspect of Elerium 115 is that its own gravity A wave, besides the gravity B wave that is native to all matter. Elerium 115’s gravity A wave is so abundant that it actually extends past the perimeter of the atom. No naturally occurring element found on earth has enough protons and neutrons that the gravity A wave of the atom extends past the perimeter of the atom. This unique trait allow us to access the gravity A wave and harness it, just like any other wave in the electromagnetic spectrum.

Elerium 115 seems to be derived from Ununpentium, an unstable, synthetic element that has been theorized to exist. Normally when Ununpentium is created it decays so fast that it has very little use. The gravity A wave disappears before it can be harnessed for more than a few seconds. By somehow manipulating the structure of Ununpentium, Elerium 115 is created. This element is completely stable, with no radioactive decay common to its unstable parent. For this reason, Elerium 115 it perhaps the most valuable element ever discovered. Elerium 115’s native properties, as well as its stable, un-radioactive nature allows it to be carried easily by carbon based life for use in many possible systems, without the worry of radiation poisoning.

The gravity A wave of Elerium 115 is its most stunning property. This gravitational force is not similar to the gravity that holds us to earth, but of the type that holds atoms together. Like many electromagnetic waves, its infinitesimal size can be amplified and focused on a distant destination to cause the space/time distortion required for practical space travel. The nature of this space travel, discussed in Einstein’s theories regarding space/time, would ‘bend’ and ‘fold’ space/time, allowing a craft to travel in a non-linear fashion. While creating solely Elerium 115 based drive systems is unlikely at this time, the Xenocide science department heavily suggests research into the creation of system to manipulate this property of Elerium 115

The stable property of Elerium 115 allows the ability to produce energy through particle bombardment. As Elerium is a stable element, particle bombardment creates an unstable, slightly higher density atom in which decay quickly occurs. The power given off during particle decay is tremendous, allowing for a vast amount of power output. Unfortunately waste particles, radioactive and otherwise, are given off during this process. These particles must be caught, or vented, creating a dilemma when considering its use as a power source. With the proper system, Elerium would be bombarded; creating an unstable molecule whose decay creates a large power output, which is then stored in a battery. Waste particles are then captured in a containment system or vented into the air.

One other property of Elerium 115 was discovered while researching particle bombardment. Certain catalysts used for bombardment destabilized the Elerium samples. This mixture of Elerium and the catalyst would lead to the creation of energized plasma. This may be the basis for the plasma weapons seen wielded by aliens in the field. Further research into this area of Elerium 115 usage is recommended.


Please critique, especially those that have been considering the Elerium problem for awhile. While I have tried to give scientific reasons for all of Elerium's propertys (as well as weave it into any current X-Net entries), I'm sure that I'm probably missing something.

So, as stated, please post comments. :D
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#2 GreatGold

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Posted 23 June 2003 - 10:35 AM

Hey -

Great draft. Some suggestions though:

1.) Really hit home on the fact that humans simply CANNOT produce Elerium. Any form of Elerium, even unstable ones, simply cannot be created.

2.) I think it would also be great to throw in a theory or two about where Elerium comes from, and why humans simply cannot synthesize it.

3.) It would be good to include something about both its mineral and molecular forms.

4.) Explain A waves more, because although it sounds cool, at least a very breif explanation of them would help things make more sense.

5.) I have always managed to obtain Plasma Weapons far before Elerium-115 is researched. This would cause problems with your last sentance referring Elerium-115 research to the development of plasma weapons.

6.) Perhaps a quote at the bottom, from a scientist involved in the research of Elerium. I'm really begining to like them ^_^ .

7.) Some of the posts, especially the one on Neutrino-Matter and the Document from Drewid, give some really great science stuff. I think we should definately incorperate them into this draft.

Thats it for the moment, I'm gonna go acquant myself with Drewid and CaptainCharisma work some more, so that I can help incorperate them.

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#3 GreatGold

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Posted 23 June 2003 - 10:39 AM

Here is a website from Drewids thread, its a must read for anyone that want's to contribute to this thread...

http://www.totse.com...energy/zpe.html

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#4 Denevive

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Posted 24 June 2003 - 11:14 AM

Hey all-

I've added a new paragraph addressing some of the issues proposed. I will say, however, that I am disappointed with the apparent lack of response to this entry. I can't update info to everyone's liking if I don't recieve any feedback. Please critique and comment, as it gives me a better understanding of what is needed from the entry. :blink:

Anyway, here's the new paragraph.

In its most basic, unrefined state Elerium 115 seems to clump together in an crystalline structure, similar in composition to quartz crystals. These crystals emanate a strange orange glow. This iridescence is completely unexplainable, and might be a result of the creation or mining process used by the extraterrestrials. It is unclear if the Aliens have to synthesize Elerium, or if the element in available in a raw state outside of our solar system. At this time, all attempts to create Ununpentium have met with failure, and it is unknown what is done to Ununpentium to create Elerium. As Elerium 115 is unavailable on earth in a raw state, it is clear that the aliens hold the monopoly on this precious element. Elerium 115’s unique properties are the possible edge we need to win this war.


After reading the information on 'zero-point energy/sea-of-energy' research, I am not sue that it would make the best addition to the Elerium 115 entry. If Elerium taps into the sea-of-energy as decribed in drewid's document, then it would never need to refuel, and would propetually power a ship, suit, fighter, etc.

I think that there might be some merit in incorporating some of this info, but it is probably not the best option when speaking about a limited fuel source. That being said, I am open to other options for Elerium's power giving properties. Perhaps it's like a long-lived, very powerful battery? :huh?:

Anyway, please post any comments you might have.
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#5 mikker

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Posted 24 June 2003 - 12:29 PM

I think elerium should be more then just power. What happened to that anti-gravity idea of elerium?

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#6 Denevive

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Posted 24 June 2003 - 12:44 PM

The original entry is at the top of the string. The gravity field is addressed in that. Another paragraph was written that addressed a few comments that were given. That's the second post of mine on this string. Just read the top entry and the anti-grav field info will become apparent. :D
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#7 mikker

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Posted 24 June 2003 - 12:49 PM

:huh?: maybe, but the words "anti-matter", and "float" are not there...:D

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#8 Denevive

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 10:14 PM

All right people, unless I hear additional info this is going to be the Elerium 115 X-Net entry sent to the assests page:


Elerium 115

For some time, scientists in the field of particle physics have been bombarding high-density atoms to produce synthetic super-heavy elements. The highest density atom found in nature is Uranium 238, and initial attempts to create new elements through particle acceleration or “atom smashing”, have failed. This seeming “sea of instability” has kept scientists for keeping synthetic atoms from decaying at an exponential rate. However, many particle physicists have theorized an “island of stability” where synthetic atoms could occur. Elerium 115, the source of alien power and propulsion, seems to be an example of an element occurring on this “island of stability”.

Elerium 115, so named due to its derivation from Ununpentium (theorized periodic table number 115), is an apparently stable super heavy element. The most important aspect of Elerium 115 is that its own gravity A wave, besides the gravity B wave that is native to all matter. Elerium 115’s gravity A wave is so abundant that it actually extends past the perimeter of the atom. No naturally occurring element found on earth has enough protons and neutrons that the gravity A wave of the atom extends past the perimeter of the atom. This unique trait allow us to access the gravity A wave and harness it, just like any other wave in the electromagnetic spectrum.

Elerium 115 seems to be derived from Ununpentium, an unstable, synthetic element that has been theorized to exist. Theorized creation of Ununpentium would result in an element that decays so fast that it has very little use. The gravity A wave would disappear before it can be harnessed for more than a few seconds. By somehow manipulating the structure of Ununpentium, our alien adversaries have created Elerium 115. This element is completely stable, with no radioactive decay common to its unstable parent. For this reason, Elerium 115 it perhaps the most valuable element ever discovered. Elerium 115’s native properties, as well as its stable, un-radioactive nature allows it to be carried easily by carbon based life for use in many possible systems, without the worry of radiation poisoning.

In its most basic, unrefined state Elerium 115 seems to clump together in an crystalline structure, similar in composition to quartz crystals. These crystals emanate a strange orange glow. This iridescence is completely unexplainable, and might be a result of the creation or mining process used by the extraterrestrials. It is unclear if the Aliens have to synthesize Elerium, or if the element in available in a raw state outside of our solar system. At this time, all attempts to create Ununpentium have met with failure, and it is unknown what is done to Ununpentium to create Elerium. As Elerium 115 is unavailable on earth in a raw state, it is clear that the aliens hold the monopoly on this precious element. Elerium 115’s unique properties are the possible edge we need to win this war.

The gravity A wave of Elerium 115 is its most stunning property. Gravity A waves are a gravitational force is not similar to the gravity that holds us to earth, but of the type that holds atoms together. Like many electromagnetic waves, its infinitesimal size can be amplified and focused on a distant destination to cause the space/time distortion required for practical space travel. The nature of this space travel, discussed in Einstein’s theories regarding space/time, would ‘bend’ and ‘fold’ space/time, allowing a craft to travel in a non-linear fashion. While creating solely Elerium 115 based drive systems is unlikely at this time, the Xenocide science department heavily suggests research into the creation of system to manipulate this property of Elerium 115

The stable property of Elerium 115 allows the ability to produce energy through particle bombardment. As Elerium is a stable element, particle bombardment creates an unstable, slightly higher density atom in which decay quickly occurs. The power given off during particle decay is tremendous, allowing for a vast amount of power output. Unfortunately waste particles, radioactive and otherwise, are given off during this process. These particles must be caught, or vented, creating a dilemma when considering its use as a power source. With the proper system, Elerium would be bombarded; creating an unstable molecule whose decay creates a large power output, which is then stored in a battery. Waste particles are then captured in a containment system or vented into the air.

One other property of Elerium 115 was discovered while researching particle bombardment. Certain catalysts used for bombardment destabilized the Elerium samples. This mixture of Elerium and the catalyst would lead to the creation of energized plasma. This may be the basis for the plasma weapons seen wielded by aliens in the field. Further research into this area of Elerium 115 usage is recommended.


Please post any and all comments on this entry. As the preacher says, "speak now or forever hold your peace."
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#9 Cpt. Boxershorts

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 10:17 PM

Looks nice. I say ship it.

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#10 Deimos

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 06:52 PM

Awesome stuff as usual Denevine. I like the a and b type gravity tie in, nice touch. Have you ever read any of Bob Lazaar's articles on the web? He allegedly used to work at area 51 on ufo propulsion.

#11 GreatGold

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 08:03 PM

Hey -

So is this going to be the final version? I say yes, as it is a great peice of work. And if anything minor needs to be changed later on, I'm sure its doable.

The reason I like this entry, is that it works when used in conjunction with the Flying Suit, Human Hybrid Craft, and Alien Craft.

My one thought is that the grammer can use an little itty bit of clean-up. I'm gonna give it a good once over, and then add any comments I have.

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#12 Denevive

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 09:06 PM

I agree that the grammar should be cleaned up a little. As I had originally mentioned, it was meant to be a rough draft and was only written in 30 minutes. The additional paragraph was written in 5. As such, I'm quite sure that I need to go over basic sentence sturcture, as I was just trying to get the ideas on paper before they caused my head to explode. :explode:

As such, I'll be happy to go over it with you GreatGold, and I'll take a moment to try and tie snetence structure together better. That being said, on to the next entry! :rock:
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#13 GreatGold

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 11:08 PM

Hey -

Donna worry, its the content thats important, and you NAILED that! I'll post what I can bu the end of the weekend.

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#14 Captain_Simian

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Posted 01 July 2003 - 04:41 AM

That's awesome

Except elements in the island of stability are expected to have half-lives of hundreds or thousands of years.... the lack of usefulness should be:
- The inability to create it
- And even if we could it would be in such small amounts it would be completely unviable as a source of fuel.

I bow down before your 35minute draft, that's good enough to be a final :master:

#15 Fred the Goat

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Posted 03 July 2003 - 08:22 PM

Yah, good stuff! I can't think of anything bad to say about it, and we all know how impressive that is! :devillaugh:

#16 warhamster

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Posted 13 July 2003 - 08:20 PM

I like it! but i must admit it keep me scratching my head. i\m not exactly sure i understood evrything. i guess i have to brush up on my ultrascience vocabulary, eh?

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#17 Denevive

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Posted 30 July 2003 - 09:47 AM

All right all,

I had a moment to use someone elses computer, so I'm posting this version of the Elerium 115 X-net entry. This is basically just a cleaner version. Anyway, here you go.


Elerium 115

For some time, scientists in the field of particle physics have been bombarding high-density atoms to produce synthetic super-heavy elements. The highest density atom found in nature is Uranium 238 and initial attempts to create new elements through particle acceleration or “atom smashing” have failed. This apparent “sea of instability” has kept scientists from keeping synthetic atoms from decaying at an exponential rate. However, many particle physicists have theorized an “island of stability” where synthetic atoms could occur. Elerium 115, the source of alien power and propulsion, seems to be an example of an element occurring on this “island of stability”.

Elerium 115, so named due to its derivation from Ununpentium (theorized periodic table number 115), is an apparently stable super-heavy element. The most important aspect of Elerium 115 is that it has its own gravity A wave, besides the gravity B wave that is native to all matter. Elerium 115’s gravity A wave is so abundant that it actually extends past the perimeter of the atom. No naturally occurring element found on earth has enough protons and neutrons that the gravity A wave of the atom extends past the perimeter of the atom. This unique trait allow us to access the gravity A wave and harness it, just like any other wave in the electromagnetic spectrum.

Elerium 115 appears to be derived from Ununpentium, an unstable, synthetic element that has been theorized to exist. In theory, the creation of Ununpentium would result in an element that decays so fast that it has very little use. The gravity A wave would disappear before it can be harnessed for more than a few seconds. By somehow manipulating the structure of Ununpentium, our alien adversaries have created Elerium 115. This element is completely stable, with none of the radioactive decay common to its unstable parent. For this reason, Elerium 115 it perhaps the most valuable element ever discovered. Elerium 115’s native properties, as well as its stable, un-radioactive nature allows it to be carried easily by carbon based life for use in many possible systems without the worry of radiation poisoning.

In its most basic, unrefined state Elerium 115 seems to clump together in a crystalline structure, similar to quartz crystals. These crystals emanate a strange orange glow, an iridescence that is completely unexplainable, and might be a result of the creation or mining process used by the extraterrestrials. It is unclear if the Aliens have to synthesize Elerium, or if the element in available in a raw state outside of our solar system. At this time, all attempts to create Ununpentium have met with failure, and it is unknown what is done to Ununpentium to create Elerium. As Elerium 115 is unavailable on earth in a raw state, it is clear that the aliens hold the monopoly on this precious element. Elerium 115’s unique properties are the possible edge we need to win this war.

The gravity A wave of Elerium 115 is its most stunning property. Gravity A waves are a gravitational force similar to the forces that hold atoms together, as opposed to Gravity B waves that are the gravitational force responsible for holding the earth in orbit. Like many electromagnetic waves, its infinitesimal size can be amplified and focused on a distant destination to cause the space/time distortion required for practical space travel. The nature of this space travel, discussed in Einstein’s theories regarding space/time, would ‘bend’ and ‘fold’ space/time, allowing a craft to travel in a non-linear fashion. While creating solely Elerium 115 based drive systems is unlikely at this time, the Xenocide science department heavily suggests research into the creation of system to manipulate this property of Elerium 115

The stable property of Elerium 115 is also very important, as it allows the ability to produce energy through particle bombardment. As Elerium is a stable element, particle bombardment creates an unstable, slightly higher density atom in which decay quickly occurs. The power given off during particle decay is tremendous, allowing for a vast amount of power output. Unfortunately waste particles, radioactive and otherwise, are given off during this process. These particles must be caught, or vented, creating a dilemma when considering its use as a power source. With the proper system, Elerium would be bombarded; creating an unstable molecule whose decay creates a large power output, which is then stored in a battery. Waste particles are then captured in a containment system or vented into the air.

One other property of Elerium 115 was discovered while researching particle bombardment. Certain catalysts used for bombardment destabilized the Elerium samples. This mixture of Elerium and catalyst particles would lead to the creation of energized plasma and may be the basis for the plasma weapons seen wielded by aliens in the field. Further research into this area of Elerium 115 usage is recommended.
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#18 Cartesian

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Posted 04 November 2003 - 12:58 AM

I realise thhat this is really REALLY late in the piece, but in terms of this games development cycle, its still early.

Denevive, you asked for some criticism. Please assume that I'm trying not to be rude and that I am trying to be constructive, but when fixing a problem one must first acknowledge there is a problem.

The gravity A wave you describe is scientific mumbo jumbo. You got it from a cranks site. I know its sci-fi and I know the guy reckons that it isn't known to traditional scientists, but the principles are all wrong and no one with any university education in physics is going to remotely buy it. The whole elerium 115 meta stable super massive element thing is interesting, but as its made out of aamtter it has to obey certain rules, and GA waves dont come into it.

Getting antigravity is really hard and one has to appeal to really exotic particles to get it, and these particles are really unstable...blah blah blah.

The closest thing I can think of to get some sort of interesting antigraivty physics would be to take some weird sort of topological defect in spacetime and have it enclose a region of no spacetime (so you have a piece of the boundary of the universe...). This is sci fi. But its kinda unfalsifiable sci fi since we know nothing about the boundary conditions of the universe and topological defects are not well understood at all as compared to the standard model which is what the gravity A waves are gonna have to come down to. Now it may turn out that there is 1 to a handful of people who could comment on this, but I don't rate the chances of this.

The rest of the antigravity stuff etcc can go nuts from here in on since we've just invoked the dragon stew principle (How does one make Dragon stew? First, you get a dragon...). Maybe if you run a current over the boundary of spacetime you get energy. Maybe yuuou get antigravity. Maybe you get a souffle. Who knows?

One thing about the topological defect if that you wont be able to probe into it, you will just have properties based upon its boundary (surface). You so wont have any chemical composition, or atoms etc. You'll just have mass (positive or negaative?) charge, spin etc. You might evven get a type of hawking radiation of it. Maybe you can stimulate hawking radiation from it, evaporating it?

Since it is so infinitely crazy there is no way Humans will be able to manufacture it, so that solves that problem.

If you wish me to expound further on this, say the word and I will make up some more crap (currently fairly unfalsifiable crap).

Edited by Cartesian, 04 November 2003 - 03:27 AM.


#19 Breunor

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Posted 04 November 2003 - 09:46 AM

That's the wonders of "elerium-115" or whatever we will call it-it can do anything we want since it doesn't exist. It's the Dragon for your stew. Feel free to create your own version of the entry, and perhaps we can take points from both to make a mutant super text! :P

#20 mikker

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Posted 04 November 2003 - 10:49 AM

but the principles are all wrong and no one with any university education in physics is going to remotely buy it.

And how many are there who both have a university education in physics and play x-com?

...maybe fred the goat....he seams to have quite some education....


....but how many ELSE are there who both have a university education in physics and play x-com?

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#21 Breunor

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Posted 04 November 2003 - 11:09 AM

It's not that the entries have to be tied 100% in reality, or that they have to include even a majority of accurate facts. But if we can reword entries to to include as much reality and accurate facts while still making it sound cool, we should aim for that IMO. It will give us the best of both worlds, rather than the best of just 1.

#22 Denevive

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Posted 04 November 2003 - 02:02 PM

Well, I just saw the huge response from Cartesian, so I'll go ahead and look over the entry. To my credit, I have to take a moment and say that your assumption that I pulled gravity A waves/ gravity B waves off a website alone is slightly insulting. I actually happen to attend a university, and while I am not a physics major, I ran this entry buy a professor in the chemistry department and he mentioned that while not labeled, it is theorized that given the proper elemental density it might be possible to harness a gravity wave, but it was far beyond our current abilities. I decided that a mix of reality and "ufo sci-fi" was more than adequate. I am by no means arguing with you about the existence/non-existence of A waves, but the inclusion of the concept worked as an excellent x-net entry. In short... please don't assume to dictate where I do or do not recieve my info.
That being said, please feel free to propose an alternate concept. Write up a quick paragraph on it and I will rewrite the entry to include it. :D
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#23 Cartesian

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Posted 04 November 2003 - 11:59 PM

First, an apology; I'm sorry, I did assume that you got it from a cranks website. I won't in the future. As I said, I don't mean to be offensive (I put that in there since I was vaguely aware it might be taken that way). Once again, apologies.

No offence to your chem prof, but... lets just say that that is VERY fringe "science". There are no papers published on it, and no one I have met has ever heard of it. It also doesn't make any physical sense whatsoever. We don't have a theory of quantum gravity yet although I know several people working on it and no one really has any room in the theory to accomodate the sort of things that are associated with E115.

I'd also like to point out that the elements 110<x<116 have beeen manufactured in the lab and nothing particularly interesting has been seen so... yeah. You get my drift. It just isn't a good idea having an element as the basis for these antigravity waves. It might have been cool to talk about that in the 60's but we have QFT now and there just isn't any possible way to fit that sort of thing in.

This is why I suggested nontrivial topology changes. This is sufficient heinous that not many ppl/no one looks at this (yet, its time will come). These won't be made in the lab for a good while yet (if ever, we are still trying for miniature black holes). The otehr good thing about non trivial topology changes is that they are by definition very odd changes to the nature of spacetime, and can possibly allow interesting and useful bending/folding of spacetime.

OK a quick paragraph. This will most likely be rubbish, and will need to be revised.. It also isn't very flowery:

Distortium almost completely baffles todays scientists. They say it shouldn't be able to exist and yet it does. It is apparently some sort of pure spacetime bent around a stable 'hole' cut out of spacetime. When placed in a rotating magnetic field it generates an as yet unidentified field which counteracts the force of gravity exactly as if it was warping spacetime. (possiblities for slow/fast passage of time in bubble should be avoided/ignored since they arent in ufo1?). The field and matter contained inside can then be accelerated with respect to an outside observer almost arbitrarily while an inside observer feels absolutely no acceleration. This can be achieved by altering the strength and inhomogeneities of the magnetic field. Naturally the possibilities for flight were first and foremost on the research team minds when this discovery was made. Finally the secret of the Alien's flight was known.

Additionally when placed in such a magnetic field charge gathers at either end of the Distortium and it is was simple to draw a current from it, sufficient in fact to power the magnetic field and power numerous other devices. Unfortunately these wonders come at a price. The Distortium will shrink with use down to nothing, so use of this precious and as yet unreproduceable resource must be carefully used. One other effect is present when elerium is being used, the copious production of neutrinos which is why we are able to clandestinely track the movements of UFOs after the widescale destruction of military and civilian radar sites.

We should put something in here about how the ufos were easily tracked when detectors tailored to the task were manufactured by xcom. something about a science team noting anomolous results at the same time ufo activity was rampant somehwere. If we could give credit to this 'find' to the Radio Ice Cherenkov Experement (RICE) in antarctica this would be cool since I know the people.

Now I havent specified the shape/size of the elerium (note the lack of 115) since it isnt necessary. I was thinking a sphere/pinched sphere/almond/seed shape?

As Distortium shrinks with use it eventuallly doesn't have enough surface area to power a UFO. At this point it would be small enough to fit into a gun/gun clip/plasma round. This wont change the usage rates or anything, and one unit of elerium is one unit, but this will unify the different sizes of device thhat use elerium/distortium.

Edited by Cartesian, 05 November 2003 - 08:29 PM.


#24 Ancalagon

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Posted 05 November 2003 - 01:36 AM

Let's open whith grammar:

The field and matter contained inside can then be accelerated with respect to an outside observer almost arbitrarily all the while feeling absolutely no acceleration by altering the strength and inhomogeneities of the magnetic field.


I can only assume that the outside observer isn't feeling the craft accelerating. Was he supposed to?. The sentance should read, "The field and matter contained inside can then be accelerated with respect to an outside observer almost arbitrarily while an inside observer feels absolutely no acceleration. This can be achieved by altering the strength and inhomogeneities of the magnetic field." I'm not sure if my two sentances are correct but I'm pretty sure yours aren't. One major problem with yours is that you never mention who is feeling no acceleration. There are other problems as well and if you want me to come up with a list of what I think are grammar problems I will. (If you have/know an english prof, teacher, I would take the paragraph to him instead of me)

Anyway, on to other stuff! I like Cartesian's (is that a reference to cartesian coordinates?) paragraph primarily because it doesn't really explain anything, so you just kind of take it for granted, instead of trying to understand everything.

Also, I thought they had never actually made ununpentium. both 116 and 114 are on my periodic table, but not 115. Oh well, I need to go to bed so I'll stop now. :zzzzz:

#25 Cartesian

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Posted 05 November 2003 - 03:09 AM

Yeah I'll leave the grammar up to someone who is more suited to such a task.I have seen excellent examples of creative writing on this website, and I do not profess to have such a talent.

"The field and matter contained inside can then be accelerated with respect to an outside observer almost arbitrarily while an inside observer feels absolutely no acceleration. This can be achieved by altering the strength and inhomogeneities of the magnetic field."

-much better, and what I meant :P . I'm sure the rest can similarly be improved upon. :P

"primarily because it doesn't really explain anything".

-Yeah, thats my point. If we say stuff which is vaguely believable someone so inclined can come and work out the details (bring on the trekkies with PhDs.). If I started making identifications on the manifold and writing down Einstein's equations we could have people come along and show that what was written is wrong. It's much harder to say something is wrong when the person says nothing at all. The second reason for not putting more details is that I assume we want to appeal to a broad audience. Techinical terms put people off very quickly and as such its not helpful to the game.

I should point out that this doesn't matter at all about the E115 issue not being very physically relevant (I forgot to). When people read books about Dragons and magic they aren't overly worried that these things dont occur naturally. It it fiction and as such disbelief is happily suspended. E115 fits right in with a universe where aliens attack. One would only want to move on from E115 if one was being pedantic. I just figure this explainantion naturally allows one to have cool UFO/avengers zipping around liike crazy without pureeing the pilots. It also provide a power source and antigravity.

Yeah, E115 has been made this year/last year: http://www.arxiv.org...310/0310032.pdf

#26 Denevive

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Posted 05 November 2003 - 03:47 AM

Alright, Cartesian. I'll start working on a rewrite, incorporating your concepts while still maintaining the flow of the entry. :D

A few clarifications though... while I personally agree that some info needs to remain "mysterious", the general concensus from the design staff guidelines (at least when I entered the project) was that a longer, far more fleshed out entry was preffered style. In the end, we always have to deal with the rabid fans who want to create their very own avenger... but this is meant to be a game, not a textbook. I know I'm going to have to think very hard to come up with a way to explain in the easiest terms possible the concept of topological defects in spacetime. :huh?:

In the end... this is science fiction. I consider myself an intelligent man, but when I play X-com (or recently UFO: Aftermath), I stop worrying about the exact science of a technology after I've gained the ability to use it. Then it's just fun.
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#27 Cartesian

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Posted 05 November 2003 - 04:32 AM

I can add more detail/explainations wherever people think it is needed.

One thing that I forgot which if ppl go for the radar array->neutrino detection idea is that when elerium is under use it emits LOTS of neutrinos (and nothing else, the charge sticks to the elerium to provide the current we wantt to power stuf). If ppl want to get techinical we can get into what types/fractions of neutrinos are emitted. This would require some more thought if ppl want me to be that specific.

A topological defect in spacetime: Easiest description would be a hole or knot in space and time. Think moebius strip only in higher dimensions as an example. Holes are easier to think of conceptually.

#28 Breunor

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Posted 05 November 2003 - 01:02 PM

We definitely shouldn't use elerium or elerium 115 for the name due to IP rights, why not say it's not on our periodic table either, or at least leave out where it would fit. I think "a previously unknown element, never before seen by human scientists" would be fair enough.

As to fleshing out descriptions, there was a consensus to include a more detailed description compared to the original game, which typically gave you 3-4 sentences and nothing more. That doesn't mean every entry has to be long, and this might be one that doesn't need quite as much info as to what it is. As to what it does, you might state a few of its properties, but it would be nice if a few are mentioned in later research as well, as the scientists learn more about it and apply it in the field.

Having the non-specific concepts and avoiding specifics that are glaring to most people is a wise idea, but at the same time Cartesian as a specialist in that area you will notice little things that 99% of the players would not. Each of us might have such specialization in different areas, and we might cringe when we here someone state something we know is wrong and want it included as "fact". If you and Denevive can work on the wording of things so that we keep the flow of the entry while avoiding major concept snafus, we'll have a very effective write-up IMO.

As to wording, we can review the final draft for grammar once all the info is in there, that won't be a problem.

#29 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 05 November 2003 - 02:09 PM

I agree with bruenor; We should have more than xcom, but we shouldn't have too much. We want alien stuff to remain [somewhat] mysterious.

Cartesian, while you may not be the best writer when it comes to grammar, you have it where it counts- knowledge.

Edited for spelling and grammar - Breunor :D (sorry, couldn't resist! ^_^ )
Edit by Cpl. Facehugger: I noticed that something was different... :)
Usually, I have spell check to check my work (Hence the huge quality difference between what I post on these forums and my CTDs. :))
edit by j'ordos: if only you knew just how many times he's actually written 'knowldage'... :rolleyes:

Edited by j'ordos, 06 November 2003 - 06:27 AM.

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#30 Cartesian

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Posted 05 November 2003 - 08:14 PM

Nothing made out of standard matter will ever have the properties you desire for E115 (the period table is made out of standard matter only). You could appeal to exotic matter and then anything goes once again, but it has to fit into a framework, ie it has to be the solution to an reasonable equation. One doesnt have to write down the equation in this case, but we should motivate it. This is not easy.

The only thing that I can think of is the hypothesised negative energy density matter used to hold open wormholes, but its not very stable (at all). This has subsequently gone out of fashion, so I doubt its a good candidate. Then again, who cares; Its a game, so maybe exotic matter is a good candidate (I wouldnt be any more specific than this).

Anyhoo, I thought of a name I dont think has IP attached to it: Distortium. Not terribly original, but not used before to my knowledge. I think it nicely encapsulates the idea of the successor to E115 while offering no real clues as to what family it fits into. I'm not sure if you guys had already thought of a new name, but I haven't seen anything other than E115...

Pronounced: dis-tor-shum

Edited by Cartesian, 05 November 2003 - 11:11 PM.


#31 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 05 November 2003 - 08:50 PM

D-115! :D

Seriously though, distortium sounds strange to me, It doesn't seem to sound right. But a D element would be nice to have! :)
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#32 Ancalagon

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Posted 05 November 2003 - 09:08 PM

At least the name distortium makes more sense than berkelium and americanum :rolleyes: .

EDIT: What about calling it disortium or distorium or disorium to make it sound more original (just an idea I came up with because I misspelled distortium in the original post). Other "ideas" include: diserium, disitium, diterium, disterium and so on.

EDIT: This makes me think that they came up with elerium by mixing the word "element" and the usuall "ium" ending of heavier atoms.

Edited by Ancalagon, 05 November 2003 - 09:17 PM.


#33 j'ordos

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Posted 06 November 2003 - 06:40 AM

difterium? :P
elysium? :)
wormholium? ;)
disturbium? ^_^
differentium? :huh:
exoticum? :wacko:
fictium? :wink:

hmm, maybe distortium isn't that bad after all :master:
Since the element is pretty weird, there's nothing bad about a weird name for it, and as Ancalagon said: many element names aren't exactly an example of catchy or cool-sounding names :hammer:
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#34 Breunor

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Posted 06 November 2003 - 08:16 AM

I like the name concept, particularly leaving out the t so that distort isn't the base of the name. Disortium sounds pretty good IMO, or Distorium.

#35 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 06 November 2003 - 04:09 PM

X-Commium! :D

If that wouldn't be possible, Diserium or any other of the D elements without Ts in them would sound nice.
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#36 Cartesian

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Posted 06 November 2003 - 05:40 PM

I like disturbium.

fractium? (derivation fractal, since we might say silly things like the topological defect was fractal in nature... actually thats kinda appealing, it explains why all the crystals of this stuff look basically the same)

Edited by Cartesian, 06 November 2003 - 06:49 PM.


#37 CptJackSparrow

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Posted 06 November 2003 - 06:38 PM

The ABC of fictitious elements:

Arminium (A-115) (arm),
Bladium (B-115) (blade),
Cimmerium (C-115) (Cimmeria),
Daunium (D-115) (Daunus),
Enerium (E-115) (energy),
Futurium (F-115) (future; arrrr... no!),
Goofium (G-115) (goofy; an honest option),
Halorium (H-115) (halo),
Icium (I-115) (ice),
Jellium (J-115) (jelly),
Kraftium (K-115) (Kraft (german: force, power)),
Lupium (L-115) (lupus (latin: wolf)),
Mamutium (M-115) (mamutas),
Neutrinium (N-115) (neutrino),
Oranium (O-115) (orange),
Pandorium (P-115) (Pandora),
Quadrium (Q-115) (quad),
Rarium (R-115) (rare),
Spesium (S-115) (spes (latin: hope)),
Turbinium (T-115) (turben (latin: turbo)) (Total Recall got it first... :crying:),
Ufium (U-115) (errr...),
Vigorium (V-115) (vigor (latin: force, energy)),
Wondrium (W-115) (wonder),
Xtremium (X-115) (extreme),
Ynotium (Y-115) (why not?),
Zeddium (Z-115) (Zed).

Not to forget the obvious opium delirium. :D

#38 j'ordos

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Posted 06 November 2003 - 06:42 PM

Hmmm... pandorium... though the name isn't very catchy I like the ambiguous meaning it gives to the element's name

Or, since we're going mythological in some other names, prometheum?
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#39 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 06 November 2003 - 06:54 PM

X-Commium? :D

I would like one that starts with D because it could sound like E! :)
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#40 Deimos

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 12:18 AM

I like Elysium for similar reasons to J'ordos. It evokes images of heaven for me which is where it originally came from so its a nice link to the Mars origins and kind of has that 1950's shock monster movie aspect to it.

It came from the heavens! :P

Oh and we'd still get to call it E115 if we wanted. Elysium 115.

Or we could use a place on Mars, the research could shows that the Element 115 has been mined from an area on Mars. So we could use.
Argyle
Valles
Pavonis
Olympus
Acidalia (quite close to Cydonia)
Sinus Meridiani
Sinus Sabeus
Cassini
Certis Major
Hellas
Vasstitas
Utopia

Or we could make up a scientist and use his name in the discovery (isn't that what happens in the real scientific world?)

Edited by Deimos, 07 November 2003 - 12:26 AM.


#41 j'ordos

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 06:07 AM

Deimonium? :)
Phobium?
Marinerium? (Valles Marineris), or Vallium :D
Maybe plain Cydonium? (though that might give away to much for the newbies, and how would we actually know where it comes from?)

Galaxium, Universium, Singularium,... to tie in with its extraterrestrial origin
Metanium for its properties (from meta-)
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#42 Breunor

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 01:09 PM

We could know it's from Mars because a few meteors we theorize are from Mars had been found with trace elements matching this stuff. There wasn't enough to test, but now that we have enough we learn how great it is. But I would avoid saying it's found in Mars but not the moon or earth, that's extremely unlikely to happen in reality. Having it come from a galaxy far, far away is appropriate due to its otherwordly properties.

Xenobium, Xenosium, Xenium? And how about it has a number 1 higher than currently listed, like 119? Xenium 119?

#43 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 07:43 PM

But what happens if they discover a new element tommorow? :P

How about Xenium 122, it kind of has a ring to it.
Or even better, Xcomium 122 :)
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#44 Ancalagon

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 08:25 PM

xcomium is sooo 1990s. xcomium 122 has less ring to it than xenium 122. Also, I'm for xenium since it fits with the title of the game and has a ring to it, like elerium 115 did.

Edited by Ancalagon, 07 November 2003 - 08:26 PM.


#45 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 09:03 PM

I know, X-comium was just a lame attempt at humor on my part. Now Xenium is Perfect in my opinion.
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#46 Ancalagon

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Posted 08 November 2003 - 04:54 PM

Poor xcomium, it never had a chance to be used in any game. :boohoo:

#47 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 08 November 2003 - 06:50 PM

It could always be included as an easteregg! :)
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#48 Deimos

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Posted 08 November 2003 - 07:34 PM

You need to go see a doctor Cpl F. :D You've got a bad case of notletitgoitus. ;)

#49 Cpl. Facehugger

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Posted 08 November 2003 - 07:35 PM

Well, last time I went to see a shrink, they sent me away because they said they couldn't help Psycho- Xenophobic Disorder. :)
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#50 Deimos

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Posted 08 November 2003 - 07:39 PM

LOL
I could help but it'd probably mean me using a large mallet :hammer: ^_^