Jump to content
XCOMUFO & Xenocide

CTD - Heavy Plasma Rifle


Recommended Posts

My knowlege of physics is limited, but i could do some research/calcuations. but i need some inputt:

how fast are we expecting the plasma to be fired?

how long is the barrel of the heavy plasma rifle?

What is the mass of the plasma that is fired?

Edited by Qonfused
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 161
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Hmm.. why is it that when reading this Weapons :: Heavy Plasma entry I get the feeling I am reading Weapon Systems :: Plasma?

 

I guess this goes for all the Weapons, people spend too much on general theory of the weapon system. That kinda sucks because the player should already have read the theory behind plasma/laser technology in the appropriate Weapons System entry. Perhaps it's a good idea to have each weapon entry explain how they adapted the technology to be usable in the field, focusing more on the 'don't tell me how a clock works, tell me what time it is' aspect of things, telling the player how X-Corps SciCorps recommends the weapon is to be deployed, flaws in its design, etc...

 

I do like like the text though, incredible job...

 

--K

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hmm...

*Reading...*

*Reading...*

Hmm...

Interestingly, it’s been discovered that, though this process, the plasma actually becomes something other than plasma, per se. Rather, through self-induced chemical transference, the plasma blast enters a semi-liquid state that is almost instantly super cooled through heat displacement matrixes lined through the barrel. Sustained by the mass of its own weight and stored kinetic energy, the plasma beam retains an incredible heat although “cooled” through variable heat displacement routines. Upon finally leaving the barrel, the projectile-based blast creates a trademark “howling whine,” as it’s been described, screaming towards its target at incredible velocities, but at a variable rate of speed due to the fact that plasma energy responds slightly differently to molecule-scaled particle accelerators.

 

Never saw this in the Plasma Weapons CTD...

Is there any scientific fact that this really happens? Not a critsism, just want to know if there's something I should read up on before stealing this for the Plasma Weapon CTD...

Feels like it belong there, as well as fix some of the nitpicks some people had with it...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It’s a bit humbling to think that the same aliens intent on exterminating the entirety of mankind from the face of the Earth are using the same form of technology its targets have endeavored to research for years to do it. Utilizing plasma energy to generate enormously powerful projectiles fired from a relatively compact rifle, the aliens have a devastating tool in their hands--the implications of their advancements make clear the fact that their knowledge of plasma flux technology is far superior to anything we’d ever fathom in hundreds of years. Plasma, as a multi-scale highly active collection of energy fluxes, particle-diffusion centers, and rapid freeform accelerators, makes for a much more perfect weapon than we’d ever imagined. It’s just a matter of execution. Refining the plasma as gravitationally-charged antimatter, rather than a simple form of usable energy, the weapon can harness the more volatile nature of its internal makeup by using a very effective “flash-heating” system that can turn simple, unrefined plasma (which, through particle acceleration, already makes for a great weapon as it is) into a deadly, destructive blast of concentrated, superheated energy.

 

Upon thorough observation of the weapon’s innards, we’ve deduced the firing mechanism’s design process. Please refer to the diagram to get a view of the rifle in action. Upon depressing the trigger, a Xenium-charged primer sparks an antimatter conductor lodged in the central energy core (see marker 1), which reassembles pre-charged energy particles located in the particle accelerator. Plasma flux growth occurs within seconds, allowing a harmonic resonator to bring an internal-source energy emitter up to hyper-acceleration levels. Finally, the magazine releases an independent, solid, shaped Xenium charge coupled with a gelatinous alien liquid (even water can be melded to such a state through hydro fusion, as there’s no specific chemical makeup for the substance.) that is used as a base for velocity acceleration.  The shaped “chunk” of Xenium passes through the sealed chamber due to a sudden burst of projective, expanding gasses, instantaneously being bombarded by superheated laser matrixes ahead, the plasma launching in temperature by at least a half a million degrees. This causes a rapid particle reaction, as escaping ionized gases rise from the literally boiling plasma sheath, triggering micro chemical transformations that amplify the plasma mass’s overall energy output by roughly ten million times its original energy capacity.

 

Interestingly, it’s been discovered that, though this process, the plasma actually becomes something other than plasma, per se.  Rather, through self-induced chemical transference, the plasma blast enters a semi-liquid state that is almost instantly super cooled through heat displacement matrixes lined through the barrel. Sustained by the mass of its own weight and stored kinetic energy, the plasma beam retains an incredible heat although “cooled” through variable heat displacement routines. Upon finally leaving the barrel, the projectile-based blast creates a trademark “howling whine,” as it’s been described, screaming towards its target at incredible velocities, but at a variable rate of speed due to the fact that plasma energy responds slightly differently to molecule-scaled particle accelerators. The “slowest” plasma discharge clocked in at just under 500 miles an hour with a force of over one million joules. And just because it’s been super cooled doesn’t mean it’s lost any stored energy--on impact, the energy stream hits with a force incredible enough to pulverize or otherwise totally obliterate concrete structures, rip through armor, and turn Heavy Weapons Platforms to heaps of shredded metal with one or two hits. Strangely, once the beam hits home, the force of its own impact cancels out the incredible heat instantly, meaning there are no lasting effects on whatever it hits. Humans or other soft targets are simply baked from the inside, meaning an unprotected individual usually dies instantaneously from incredible burn wounds. Thanks to the fact that the plasma shot dissipates within milliseconds, victims aren’t simply reduced to ash, although that was probably the intention. This pure destructive power puts the [finalized name] in a whole new group from its peers, but it also comes with a price, which explains its rarity among alien troops. The construction of the weapon requires a good deal of Xenium, which is a precious resource, and its hardy construction comes with a high requirement of [alloy].

 

i must say i dont understand several points, so could you explain them to me:

 

-"…plasma energy to generate enormously powerful projectiles fired from a relatively compact rifle…", Plasma energy? Im not a expert on plasma physics, but isn’t plasma kind of a 4. form of matter(solid, liquid, gass, plasma.) . a low density, fully ionized gass that contains equally numbers of positive and negative ions. In other words, a really hot and magnetic gass.

 

Isn’t the plasma, the projectile?

 

 

“…their knowledge of plasma flux technology is far superior to anything we’d ever fathom in hundreds of years. Plasma, as a multi-scale highly active collection of energy fluxes, particle-diffusion centers, and rapid freeform accelerators,…”

Plasma flux? Isn’t flux the sum of magnetic forces?

 

What is “Particle diffusion centers”? and “Rapid freeform accelerators”?

“…Refining the plasma as gravitationally-charged antimatter…”

Is plasma antimatter? I don’t think it is, it wouldn’t make any sense.

 

“flash-heating”, “unrefined plasma”

what are these words? Are talking about warming up something really fast? And does unrefined plasma mean the matter you are going to make the plasma with.

 

 

“rather than a simple form of usable energy”Is plasma a simple form of usable energy?

 

“antimatter conductor”A what now?

 

“harmonic resonator to bring an internal-source energy emitter up to hyper-acceleration levels”what, what, what?

 

“Plasma flux growth occurs within seconds, allowing a harmonic resonator to bring an internal-source energy emitter up to hyper-acceleration levels. Finally, the magazine releases an independent, solid, shaped Xenium charge coupled with a gelatinous alien liquid”how can you have plasma flux, without the plasma?

 

“hydro fusion”this is something I have never hear of. Liquid fusion?

 

Im only half way through and, here, and theres pages of stuff Im not even able to begin comprehending.

And with the fact that you don’t know the value of a joule. I have to question you sources.Sorry. :blink2:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

L O L

 

Qonfused please keep in mind that everything in this game is FICTION :P. We aren't here to try to figure out how plasma weapons would work (though if we could that'd be cool :D). I've always thought of the CTDs just as a way to dazzle the player with ridiculous techobabble that only makes half-sense in the real world. I understand that you have enough knowledge to refute much of what blehm has written here but I doubt that much of anything going on in Xenocide is going to make much sense.

 

There is a very low chance that the player will have any idea what we are talking about

 

so I don't think he is going to complain if we use the word flux the wrong way.

 

However, I must agree that this CTD in its current state is a little too convoluted for my tastes and it is technobabble that doesn't even make half sense. There is just too much going on. I think that if you boil this down into something simpler it could be quite nice, but right now it just feels like overkill. Most importantly I don't see myself, or any other new player, playing this game for the first time and bothering to read through much of it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I know that the rules of required realism of CDT entries are dull at best. But I think we should strive at making things as flawless as possible. And I am picky on these physics subjects because I study them, no harm intended.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I know that the rules of required realism of CDT entries are dull at best. But I think we should strive at making things as flawless as possible. And I am picky on these physics subjects because I study them, no harm intended.

 

I do agree. Even though I've read that plasma weapons could not exist (due to reasons above my head <_ we should try to make this a believable as possible. i have concur with qonfused on his earlier post saying there are too many scientific errors. ct will probably be re-written.>

 

The one thing that got me the most was "antimatter conductor", antimatter causes explosive results with any sort of matter, how in the world would you know if it conducts, and what conducts it???? :rolleyes:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

Ahem--since I'm a bit cramped for time at the moment (I'm currently at a library computer right now...oh, the shame), I'll get technical at my next chance to go online. Just to cut it short for now, the "magic" part doesn't really "click" with me.

 

 

I was already on the task of a re-write about a month ago when my computer fried. Give me a bit of time and I'll see what I can do.

 

(By the way, most of the technical information was researched from a Physics schoolbook. :P Don't worry, I intend to redo this--this was never meant to be final to begin with, as I just wanted to get the basic structure down. I went on a limb here for a reason.)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

okay, this was meant to be the final version back in june, but TMM had to go and continue posting, so take a look at this:

 

[Heavy plasma]

 

Again, the aliens are showing us what they are capable of with a weapon of such firepower and precision. The Heavy plasma is the largest in the plasma family we’ve encountered so far, and by judging by the amazing yield of the [heavy plasma], we hope that this is the last one. Heavier than its predecessor, the Plasma Rifle, it is still much lighter than a [Heavy cannon] or the [Autocannon], 2 of the few weapons even remotely matching the [Heavy Plasma] in firepower, which gives this assault weapon a distinct advantage when it comes to precision. Also, it features an auto-shot setting that normally is found only on Assault Rifles, further making this weapons a favorite among weapons testers.

 

The Heavy Plasma clip contains twice the amount of rounds than most of its counterparts and is impressively powerful, capable of knocking out even the toughest enemies in only a couple hits. Easy to manipulate, it is very a formidable weapon to have in all kind of combat situations as soldiers do not have to reload often.

 

While surely this will become the standard weapon in the ranks of X-Corp, unfortunately we are unable to reproduce this level of technology, without expending massive amounts of both resources and money.

 

"What are you guys so scared of, its only a Ventriculant?"-[squaddie] Fred Walsh, shortly before being blasted to molecular heck

 

 

The inner working of the [heavy plasma] seem very different and radical, compared to the simple working of the [standard rifle]. For example, the [standard rifle] uses a simple method of pulling a trigger, which sets off a charge shooting the bullet out of the gun. But the [heavy plasma], on the other hand, utilizes a complex and intricate system of energy wires and Xenium charges, as well as multiple plasma shapers, to even form the plasma, at which point it is accelerated out of the outlet via an incredibly expensive and powerful mass driver system. After that, the end of the barrel is an EMP projector to keep the plasma along its path, until striking the target. Many x-corps scientist and engineers believe that it does not need to be so complicated, but due to the fact that the aliens are far more advanced than we humans are, they have yet to find a simpler way.

 

"See this button?" "Yeah." "Whatever you do don't touch it." "You mean this one?" *woosh* "I said don't touch it!" "Sorry!"-Captain John Richards using a heavy plasma for the first time with a scientist

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

Sorry for bumping this old thread, but I'm currently proofreading the other plasma CTs, and this is mainly a note for the roving CTD squad and future proofreaders.

 

A lot of this CT (and the Plasma Cannon CT) will have to be rewritten to be consistent with the other plasma weapons. Please refer to the Plasma Weapons Systems CT, Plasma Rifle CT, and the Plasma Pistol CT.

 

Also, since the CTD ultimately has to defer to the Art Department, please take a look at their work. Plasma weapons are in this thread. Heavy plasma is on page 1 (post #21), the Plasma Cannon on page 4 (post #118). You really have to admire the evolution of the design process, though. Those Art Department folks really take pride in their work, and you can see it in their results! :)

 

Anyway, these are the changes I feel are necessary for consistency reasons after a quick glance, and these should be addressed in their respective CTs.

 

- Plasma weapons possess "anterior magneto-dynamic prongs". The plasma pistol has 2 prongs, the plasma rifle has 3. From the Art Department's models, Heavy plasmas have 4 and Plasma Cannons have 8 such prongs. These prongs help "collimate" the plasma (collimate means to line up).

 

- Larger plasma weapons should possess longer barrels to account for accuracy increases.

 

- Plasma is generated in a "plasma-generation chamber" and contained via magnetic fields. The plasma-generation chamber of larger plasma weapons should be larger than its predecessors to account for their increased power/plasma output.

 

- Heat sinks direct heat away from the user.

Edited by Astyanax
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hello all,

 

I have returned from a rather long sabbatical...I doubt that many of you remember me, but I was involved in writing the several of the other plasma CTD's. I'm going to write a version of this entry in the next few days, with the intention of resolving the issues of consistency and accuracy.

 

I will do my best to incorporate the positive elements of both blehm's and mm's writing. I would definitely appreciate comments from everyone that has been involved in this discussion during the writing process. As I said, I should have a rough draft up within a couple of days.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ok, so here's the initial stab at it. I haven't proofread it at all, it's just as I originally typed it here in the last half hour or so. Please feel free to make suggestions.

 

A bit of insight - I tried to put in some of what I would call the "breathless enthusiasm" of MM's post in particular. It may sound strange since it is me, the incredibly laid-back man, writing it...tell me what you think. In particular, I need an intro and conclusion (as my comp teachers tell me).

 

HEAVY PLASMA

X-Net://Pegasus.net/Alien/Weapons/Heavy Plasma

 

The heavy plasma is the most powerful non-explosive weapon in the Aliens’ arsenal. Combining accuracy, firepower, and relatively light weight, this weapon is a favorite of soldiers, scientists, and the aliens.

 

The weapon’s appearance is known to cause fear in the bravest of humans, particularly those who have seen what it is capable of. The huge barrel caliber, prominent magneto-dynamic prongs, and overall size only hint at its destructive power.

 

This monster’s oversized plasma generation chamber is a work of art. After the two fluids are pumped into the chamber, an RF pulse produces a tremendous explosion that transforms the raw ammunition into plasma. The chamber reflects most of the energy, but harnesses some and uses it to ensure that none of the newly formed plasma contacts any interior surface. The plasma is then accelerated out of the barrel using electromagnetic fields.

 

Four magneto-dynamic prongs are used to collimate, control, and further accelerate the plasma. By the time the plasma leaves the barrel, it has a velocity of over a thousand meters per second. It is the opinion of several X-corps engineers that a fifth prong should have been added for increased accuracy, as the current four are barely able to contain the beam. However, such a change would require a complete redesign of all the circuitry in the weapon, and slightly lower the damage potential of the weapon because more of the plasma’s energy would be used in the collimation process.

 

The weapon is large enough to require two grip-gloves, and is so bulky that it cannot be fired from the shoulder like traditional weapons. The Aliens appear to use some advanced type of targeting system, however, it has proven to be incompatible with human physiology. Instead, all human weapons will be augmented by the use of an infrared laser sight and accompanying eyepiece that will allow the soldier to see the beam.

 

The damage caused by a plasma hit is fearsome to behold. The energy of the particles is sufficient to disrupt the target at an atomic level, not only ionizing atoms by knocking off electrons but actually ripping apart the atomic nuclei themselves. The amount of energy present is commonly enough to “dissolve” the first surface struck, leaving behind only hydrogen and other light gases. The repair of such wounds takes an extremely long time to heal, and the technology used to assist it is more prosthetic than recuperative in nature.

 

Need to put some kind of conclusion here…and fluff…

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest Azrael

I'll try to help you :)

 

HEAVY PLASMA

X-Net://Pegasus.net/Alien/Weapons/Heavy Plasma

 

The heavy plasma is the most powerful non-explosive weapon in the Aliens’ arsenal. Combining accuracy, firepower, and relatively light weight, this weapon is a favorite of soldiers, scientists, and the aliens.

 

At the point of encountering a heavy plasma, you may not have seen a blaster launcher, so you don't know if they do have explosive weapons, plus, we don't really know if the heavy plasma is the most powerful or if there are more powerful plasma weapons or of other types. I wouldn't say it's a favourite of our soldiers; cause they haven't used one until now, nor the scientists use them (so they don't have favourite), and the Aliens..it's debatible, I think the blaster launcher is their favourite :D, but we don't really know that.

 

The weapon’s appearance is known to cause fear in the bravest of humans, particularly those who have seen what it is capable of. The huge barrel caliber, prominent magneto-dynamic prongs, and overall size only hint at its destructive power.

 

Instead of "bravest of Humans", why don't you make it "bravest of troopers" or somethign like that?, the only ones who know what it is are X-Corps soldiers.

 

This monster’s oversized plasma generation chamber is a work of art. After the two fluids are pumped into the chamber, an RF pulse produces a tremendous explosion that transforms the raw ammunition into plasma. The chamber reflects most of the energy, but harnesses some and uses it to ensure that none of the newly formed plasma contacts any interior surface. The plasma is then accelerated out of the barrel using electromagnetic fields.

 

I wouldn't compare this to a "monster", remember that as a scientific report of some sorts, it's supposed to be as heartless as possible. "Oversized" is kinda contradictory with "work of art" IMHO, how about just "large"?.

RF?, please put the complete meaning before using an acronym, with it in parenthesis the first time, I don't know what it is :)

 

Four magneto-dynamic prongs are used to collimate, control, and further accelerate the plasma. By the time the plasma leaves the barrel, it has a velocity of over a thousand meters per second. It is the opinion of several X-corps engineers that a fifth prong should have been added for increased accuracy, as the current four are barely able to contain the beam. However, such a change would require a complete redesign of all the circuitry in the weapon, and slightly lower the damage potential of the weapon because more of the plasma’s energy would be used in the collimation process.

 

This paragraph would leave open to expect the introduction of a fourth plasma weapon, which we will not, maybe you could explain a reason of why it's just not possible or useful to add a fifth prong?, like the plasma reacting erratically or something.

 

The weapon is large enough to require two grip-gloves, and is so bulky that it cannot be fired from the shoulder like traditional weapons. The Aliens appear to use some advanced type of targeting system, however, it has proven to be incompatible with human physiology. Instead, all human weapons will be augmented by the use of an infrared laser sight and accompanying eyepiece that will allow the soldier to see the beam.

 

I'm confused by this paragraph, how can it be incompatible with Human physiology? a soldier can grab and use a h.plasma right from the battlefield, so I don't get this much. Also, I don't get the last part either, why are human weapons being augmented?, I assume the beam you are talking about is part of the targeting system (you should mention it above), but human weapons don't have eyepieces, armors do, and they will not be modified later in the game. Maybe I'm getting this all wrong? :huh:

 

The damage caused by a plasma hit is fearsome to behold. The energy of the particles is sufficient to disrupt the target at an atomic level, not only ionizing atoms by knocking off electrons but actually ripping apart the atomic nuclei themselves. The amount of energy present is commonly enough to “dissolve” the first surface struck, leaving behind only hydrogen and other light gases. The repair of such wounds takes an extremely long time to heal, and the technology used to assist it is more prosthetic than recuperative in nature.

 

Fluff suggestion:

"YES!, I've already told you before, this thing ALSO uses clips!"

-Scientist X to Soldier Y

or

"Eat my plasma bug-eyes!"

Yes, my fluffs are not very good :), this is a good start, I agree though that you need a better introduction...I'll try to think of something, got my mind kinda clouded tonight :)

Edited by Azrael
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Az,

 

Helpful comments. Let me address a couple (BTW, it's late and I'm tired, so...)

 

Issue #1 - do I write this thing assuming that they will only, ever, read it when they first research it? If so, then I'll put "most powerful in the alien's arsenal." If not, well...I suppose "one of the" will have to suffice. As far as scientists, yes, I would say they've played with them, and I wouldn't doubt if they've had a few not strictly necessary tests. But that paragraphs basically needs rewritten.

 

#2 will do. Good points.

 

#3 also good. Part of that was me trying to sound excited. Other was just silly.

 

#4 good. Will do. That was there to explain slightly less accuracy under certain circumstances (aimed shot).

 

#5 actually, so this whole paragraph is sort of interesting. It's primarily prompted by some discussion I had "back in the day" and throughout the heavy plasma art thread where the "human versions" of this gun will have handles and more normal triggers. It's probably V1.0+, I never got a straight answer. There's a lot of discussion about those grip-gloves being psionic focii and such. The last was from a PM I received from someone, I'll look it up in the morning, and get back to you. Basically that was "supposed to be in there" a long time ago, maybe that has changed now. Or it might be 1.0+...

 

So, all told, thanks, will work and repost. Probably in .rtf 'cause this thread is getting long. Probably Monday-ish, gotta go now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ah, I found it (the eyepiece bit). It came from Breunor, though my memory has shuffled it a bit. I'll just put his text here.

 

"One of the items we've talked about for the heavy weapons was that it would have a wireless HUD transmitter built in, which feeds info to the soldiers helmet HUD. Both the heavy laser and heavy plasma have it, as they are fired from the hip due to weight but still have better accuracy than the rifles. Each has a targetting laser which paints whatever it's aimed at, and the HUD has a filter which picks up the wavelength as a seperate color. This lets the soldier know where they're aiming."

 

I note now that it is "one of the items we talked about" not "what's going to happen." But it did do a reasonable job of explaining why a weapon with no visible sights was so stinking accurate...what'dya say? Keep it or axe it?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

there's two mechanisms discussed in alien weapons threads that pose problems. the human one is the camera-and-HUD targeting, and the alien one is the psi-activated-weaponry. both are big trouble, because they both imply that weapons constructed by one cannot be used by the others without modifications. which is simply not true, because since this game is supposed to be similar to X-Com in V1, it is definitely possible to just pick up a dead alien's weapon (one you've already researched, anyway) and use it in battle.

 

I guess the HUD thing has to be scrapped, at least if it's supposed to be coupled with an on-weapon camera.

It might find its way into the advanced armor, to explain why people can still aim accurately while wearing something bulky, perhaps with a bit about sensors integrated into the armor relaying information about weapon position (extrapolated from position information of arms and legs) and projecting the probable trajectory of projectiles in the helmet-integrated HUD.

 

The other thing is aliens controlling weapons via psi. while this can not be used to fire the weapons, as humans have to be able to fire them without knowing of psi powers yet, I guess it can be used to explain the superior accuracy of aliens in higher difficulty settings.

 

(I asked the HUD question over at the art department's "Shirt Armor" thread, and the answer was "there's definitely not going to be any kind of eyepiece or other HUD on the basic armor.)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest Azrael
(I asked the HUD question over at the art department's "Shirt Armor" thread, and the answer was "there's definitely not going to be any kind of eyepiece or other HUD on the basic armor.)

Not completely true :)

 

An attached headset connects each X-Corps agent to his superiors, and has a pull-down screen over the right eye with Shodan target acquisition and evaluation software.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

that's what I would have thought, but Vaaish said here that "I would see the next level armor being the first level to be able to jack into the weapon cams." :Deal:

 

...now I don't know how you would interpret that... :D

 

EDIT: and then there's still the issue about X-Corps soldiers not being able to pick up dead aliens' weapons and use them.

Edited by Moriarty
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm more than happy to scrap the "incompatible with " bit, no problem there at all, provided that it's the official decision. If there is a HUD of some type on all armor, then I think that the infrared/non-visible laser beam targeting idea is good in that it explains the accuracy of a huge, hip-fired weapon.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest Azrael
it should be possible to scale it a bit lower, with the chances of handles.

 

I'll check out with the sights. (any links of what you mean? I now the OICW, but what sight would you talk about? The gun is too low, and would require hanging a scope quite high in the air, and that would look plain stupid.)

 

Sorta like the OICW. not actually siting through the scope... the scope is a video camera zeroed to teh weapon, it transmits the signal to a display screen in the helmet.

 

 

@ Red Knight: Yes sir, will do sir.

 

@ Vaaich: Good idea. Acturly, this is a good idea for ALL weapons, not just the heavy laser. This should be added into the "standart issue armour" CT.

 

 

@ Vaaich: Good idea. Acturly, this is a good idea for ALL weapons, not just the heavy laser. This should be added into the "standart issue armour" CT.

I think it already is, something about a HUD, tell me specifically what you want and we'll see that it fits.

 

 

I think it's actually in use in modern warfare (The landwarrior - thing like Vaaich said). A small camera is placed on top of the weapon (with a little crosshair in the middle), and that leads to a small monitor in front of youre eye. This means that you can see where you are aiming, gunview. AFAIK, you can add night vission to said cameras, for night times.

 

It shouldn't really do anything, just a little note in the CT.

 

 

An attached headset connects each X-Corps agent to his superiors, and has a pull-down screen over the right eye with Shodan target acquisition and evaluation software.

This is on the text already, is this enough?

 

 

Azrael: yes, that blurb should be enough...

 

@Shinzon: the blue color scheme looks quite nice, different from the standard "red lasers"

 

I would keep the front portion as it is and cncentrate on adding detail to the indention on the back and the grip. The rest looks good as it is.

 

Keep it up!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

and then there's still the issue about X-Corps soldiers not being able to pick up dead aliens' weapons and use them.

 

 

:NyaNyaNya: sorry to be so obnoxious. but how are we going to explain that? either the aliens too have little cameras on their weapons - or the X-Corps soldiers carry little cameras with them that can be magnetically attached to captured weapons. which is silly. :D

 

(I truly am sorry for bugging you with this. :sorry: but I am a logic freak.)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

and then there's still the issue about X-Corps soldiers not being able to pick up dead aliens' weapons and use them.

 

:NyaNyaNya: sorry to be so obnoxious. but how are we going to explain that? either the aliens too have little cameras on their weapons - or the X-Corps soldiers carry little cameras with them that can be magnetically attached to captured weapons. which is silly. :D

 

(I truly am sorry for bugging you with this. :sorry: but I am a logic freak.)

 

Just give them an accurecy penelty if it's taken from the field. Would make sence.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just give them an accurecy penelty if it's taken from the field. Would make sence.

 

that would be a solution. but how will you be able to distinguish between a human-built (or retrofitted, if that's possible) weapon from an original alien one? this could be getting out of hand.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

the reason for all this discussion was that the Heavy Laser, Heavy Plasma and Heavy Human Rifle are all too big to be fired from the shoulder. they have to be carried at the hip. and the Laser and Plasma are extremely accurate, which somehow feels wrong, because hip-carried weapons are hard to aim. the only weapons fired from the hip are usually fast-firing machine guns - you don't have to hit with the first shot, you just hose the area, making corrections to the aim as you fire. but the plasma and laser are single-shot weapons. hence the discussion.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

the reason for all this discussion was that the Heavy Laser, Heavy Plasma and Heavy Human Rifle are all too big to be fired from the shoulder. they have to be carried at the hip. and the Laser and Plasma are extremely accurate, which somehow feels wrong, because hip-carried weapons are hard to aim. the only weapons fired from the hip are usually fast-firing machine guns - you don't have to hit with the first shot, you just hose the area, making corrections to the aim as you fire. but the plasma and laser are single-shot weapons. hence the discussion.

 

well... hmm...

 

Maybe the heavy plasma uses this psi aiming device - not anything that would require psi strenght at all, just normal impulses. The laser and normal heavy weapon will have a camera, because it has already been made, and can't be found in the hands of the aliens. Hence, the heavy plasma won't have a camera. The psi aim is more then enough.

Edited by mikker
Link to comment
Share on other sites

you mean, like, "upon first firing tests with this Heavy Plasma Rifle, it turned out that the weapon was more accurate than expected. investigation into this showed that the distal third of the plasma funnel is lined with impulse-adjusting magnets linked to a complex circuitry that we haven't yet been able to understand, although we can replicate it. this component appears to be adjusting the direction of the fired plasma so that it hits the targetted spot more precisely than possible with simple point-and-fire tactics. test subjects have been heard to refer to this as "the weapon knows where to shoot"."

 

...something like that? just a hint of a passive psi-mechanism, but no actual mentioning, because it would create a cross-link between this and psi.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

First off, let me say thank you Moriarty for picking on this. I think it is a reasonably serious issue in terms of consistency. Here's a bit of text from the heavy laser (final) entry.

 

The integrated targeting computer is a high-grade target acquisition system which emits a low-powered targeting laser when the safety is released. This targeting laser is aligned with the main laser beam and acts as a sight. The soldier’s HUD is sensitive to the targeting laser’s wavelength, allowing the soldier to determine when the weapon is on target with point-and-click accuracy.

 

I was told that a similar thing was supposed to be used for the hp to explain additional accuracy despite the fact that it is held, aimed, and fired differently than any weapon the soldiers would have trained with. However, as the CTD must bow to the art department, and they seem to have tossed the HUD for the first iteration of armor (even though it's supposed to look futuristic), we've got no HUD. And neither do the Hvy Lsr crowd...

 

I think Mikker's suggestion/Moriarty's most recent text could be implemented...I'll toy with it tomorrow sometime (if you wondered, I'm about to go out of town and don't have time for a rewrite, but can responsd to short questions).

 

From the discussion going on in the art thread on plasmas, it definitely sounded like they wanted to make it so that humans couldn't use weapons taken from the field, and most of them thought no one ever did it. In fact, I clearly remember one instance where I had researched the weapon but not the clip and won a mission b/c someone picked up a plasma pistol... Anyway, some of this was there to provoke this type of discussion because I sensed a bit of inconsistency, thank you again moriarity for showing how much there was.

Edited by Kikanaide
Link to comment
Share on other sites

jep - works for me. Although that text from the quote you posted should be moved over to the heavy rifle CTD, and only refearing in the heavy laser that it, too, uses this device?
Link to comment
Share on other sites

jep - works for me. Although that text from the quote you posted should be moved over to the heavy rifle CTD, and only refearing in the heavy laser that it, too, uses this device?

Ok, so my interpretation is this: We move that quoted text from heavy laser to heavy rifle, mention in heavy laser that it uses the same technology, and then use the psionic aiming device per your idea for the plasma? But what about the fact that we still don't have a HUD on the existing drawings for the initial suit? I can confidently update the text for plasma now, but I would like to know what the outcome of the laser sight is...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ok, so my interpretation is this: We move that quoted text from heavy laser to heavy rifle, mention in heavy laser that it uses the same technology, and then use the psionic aiming device per your idea for the plasma?

The problem is that, also I really like the idea, AFAIK you are able to research Plasma before psi... So how do you explain this aiming device then?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ok, so my interpretation is this: We move that quoted text from heavy laser to heavy rifle, mention in heavy laser that it uses the same technology, and then use the psionic aiming device per your idea for the plasma?

The problem is that, also I really like the idea, AFAIK you are able to research Plasma before psi... So how do you explain this aiming device then?

 

easy: you don't. Scientists might know how it's build and what it's made of, but not what exactly it does.

 

Also, you could make the heavy plasma a pre-requirement for PSI, although that might be too far away from the original.

 

And kikanade: a little patch over the eye wouldn't take that much time to make, would it? :)

Edited by mikker
Link to comment
Share on other sites

easy: you don't. Scientists might know how it's build and what it's made of, but not what exactly it does.

 

that's exactly what I was thinking. and I thought my text said that :) the system is too complicated to understand directly, but the scientists are able to give the engineers a blueprint. perhaps the system will be understood one day, but for now it just isn't a priority in research, so we don't have to explain anything. (this is how sci-fi works :D )

Link to comment
Share on other sites

[The problem is that, also I really like the idea, AFAIK you are able to research Plasma before psi... So how do you explain this aiming device then?

 

This is a legitimate question, Mad. As the others have stated above, we'll have to do a bit of "dodging." Basically I'm going to use a slightly-modified version of the text Moriarty put in an earlier post which never mentions the word psionics specifically. Basically it's just going to be a strange circuit that we can rebuild but not understand, but enough of the description will be clear that a player who knows about psionics will know what's going on.

 

And Mikker, with the eyepatch thing, no, I wouldn't imagine it's terribly hard...I just don't know how to do it :). If you or someone else can get it put onto the standard dress that would be great IMO.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

HEAVY PLASMA

X-Net://Pegasus.net/Alien/Weapons/Heavy Plasma

 

The heavy plasma is the most powerful non-explosive weapon in the Aliens’ arsenal. Combining accuracy, firepower, and relatively light weight, this weapon is a favored choice by the Aliens - for good reason.

 

The weapon’s appearance is known to cause fear in the bravest of troopers, particularly those who have seen what it is capable of. The huge barrel caliber, prominent magneto-dynamic prongs, and overall size only hint at its destructive power. Yet beneath the deadly-looking exterior lies circuitry so advanced that its basic mechanics are not yet understood.

 

The economy-size plasma generation chamber is a work of art. After the two fluids are pumped into the chamber, an electromagnetic pulse produces a tremendous explosion that transforms the raw ammunition into plasma. The chamber reflects most of the energy, but harnesses some and uses it to ensure that none of the newly formed plasma contacts any interior surface. The plasma is then accelerated out of the barrel using electromagnetic fields.

 

Four magneto-dynamic prongs are used to collimate, control, and further accelerate the plasma. By the time the plasma leaves the barrel, it has a velocity of over a thousand meters per second. It is the opinion of several X-corps engineers that a fifth prong should have been added for increased accuracy, as the current four are barely able to contain the beam. However, initial investigations into this change has resulted in catastrophic failure, ranging from simple inoperability to plasma destabilization. It becomes additionally evident that the circuitry surrounding the prongs is not yet understood.

 

The weapon is large enough to require two grip-gloves, and is so bulky that it cannot be fired from the shoulder like traditional weapons. Instead, it is fired from the hip. At first, this method seemed to be incompatible with the high degree of accuracy that Alien soldiers achieve in the field. However, initial firing tests showed that the weapon was more accurate than most human weaponry. Investigation into this showed that the distal third of the plasma funnel is lined with impulse-adjusting superconducting electromagnets linked to complex circuitry that has no observable input. It is possible to copy the circuitry, and experiments have proven the replicated modules to operate identically. This component appears to be adjusting the direction of the fired plasma so that it hits the targetted spot more precisely than possible with simple point-and-fire tactics. Test subjects have been heard to refer to this as "the weapon knows where to shoot," and if it were not so unbelievable of an idea, that would appear to be precisely what is occuring. Though embarrassing as it is to admit, it acts very much as if it is reading the wielder's mind. What is certain is that this weapon does not require or benefit from the normal augmentations to heavy weaponry.

 

The damage caused by a plasma hit is fearsome to behold. The energy of the particles is sufficient to disrupt the target at an atomic level, not only ionizing atoms by knocking off electrons but actually ripping apart the atomic nuclei themselves. The amount of energy present is commonly enough to “dissolve” the first surface struck, leaving behind only hydrogen and other light gases. The repair of such wounds takes an extremely long time to heal, and the technology used to assist it is more prosthetic than recuperative in nature.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

sounds all very good to me. just two little things:

 

The damage caused by a plasma hit is fearsome to behold. The energy of the particles is sufficient to disrupt the target at an atomic level, not only ionizing atoms by knocking off electrons but actually ripping apart the atomic nuclei themselves. The amount of energy present is commonly enough to “dissolve” the first surface struck, leaving behind only hydrogen and other light gases. The repair of such wounds takes an extremely long time to heal, and the technology used to assist it is more prosthetic than recuperative in nature.

 

1) I don't know if this is perhaps just a little bit too powerful... ripping apart atomic nuclei is very tough business.

 

2) it is probably not very wise to say anything about Heavy Plasma Rifles causing wounds that don't heal ("more prosthetic than recuperative"). after all, there will be numerous occasions where your troopers will be hit by these weapons, and I don't think that long-term lasting damage is something planned in this game... yes, it takes a long time (then again, not that long... the soldiers heal quite fast when compared to real life), but they are good as new when they report back for duty.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ok, so I had a 15 minute discussion about this with a professor...kind of surprised that he took it seriously but, then again, he is one of the coolest faculty I know.

 

Turns out yes, I overestimated the energies a bit (oh, you know, a few orders of magnitude), although plasma could create such an effect it would have to be hot "for a plasma," which is hot indeed.

 

So rather than tear apart atoms (which it might, but probably wouldn't happen unless we throw these things at relativistic speeds, which I think our programming and art department would get upset with us for), it mainly just ionizes atoms and breaks molecular bonds. I say "just," but a quick-thinking person will notice that biological organisms are based on the interworking of just a massive number of molecules (even in just one cell), and that disrupting, you know, all of them - ish, is not something that a tissue can survive.

 

So yes, it burns. It burns things that would normally be resistant to chemical flames of a few thousand degrees...It burns all. What's left isn't hydrogen gas as I hypothesized, but instead just a crapload of unbound ions where there used to be molecules working together to form cells. You might be able to tell that it used to be human tissue with measurements of atomic concentrations, but every bit of biology you tried would fail you.

 

So, expect a rewrite soon (tonight?) . Comments or suggestions on how to make "ionizing atoms and disrupting molecules" sound like the type of death that it is to someone who's not familiar with it?

 

edit - forgot to comment on the prosthetic recovery. You are probably correct in saying that it normally implies a general decline in function... Does anyone have a problem with me saying that "we have had to develop new techniques to help regenerate cells and tissues destroyed by this weapon," only without the "we"? Cause, I mean, it only takes a few weeks or months to heal, but this isn't the boiling water scald you get when you pull a pan off a stove...and we're set (10?) years in the future...

Edited by Kikanaide
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The problem is that we're about as likely to have such medical tech as we are to have, say, Xenium before the Aliens come.:-)

 

Quite simply, such injuries don't happen very often. When they do, there's nothing really to do, because such people tend to be dead.

 

Maybe a new tech: Improved Medical Care?

 

No idea what it would do, though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, hrm... I'm not sure what to do about this then. Here's what we have to make consistent -

 

1. Plasma wounds are much like severe burns.

 

2. A "minor" hit can take only days or weeks to recover. A near-death experience a month or two at most (from my memories of the game...any better ideas of timeframes would be helpful).

 

3. Burns severe enough to kill (and kill quickly, not in minutes or even seconds) destroy - not damage - tissue. We're talking third-degree burns, which currently require skin/tissue grafts and other joyous recovery processes.

 

The way I see it (and please, please comment if you see another possibility) is that we have to do one of the following:

 

1. Say that medical treatment has improved into the realm of partial regeneration

2. Say that prosthetics technology has improved to the point where partial replacement without any impact on function is possible.

3. Say that burn treatment technology now includes cloning for skin grafts

4. Describe the burn and leave the treatment to the doctors...and out of my CT

 

I suppose 4 is probably the best option, really. Anything else seems like it's just opening a can of worms which we don't even need to...

 

Edit - severe burns happen all the time... Though not on the level perhaps that plasma would inflict, the basic physiological significance of a burn is ionizing atoms (and thus disrupting molecules and everything prescribed)...

Edited by Kikanaide
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Does anyone have a problem with me saying that "we have had to develop new techniques to help regenerate cells and tissues destroyed by this weapon," only without the "we"?  Cause, I mean, it only takes a few weeks or months to heal, but this isn't the boiling water scald you get when you pull a pan off a stove...and we're set (10?) years in the future...

Well, why not say something like: "Based on various breakthroughs in trauma medicine in the last years and random observations on alien tissue we could develop an Interferon-inhibior/Growthfactor/Stamcell-mixture which is locally preventing an inflamation and simultaniously stimulating the fetal-like recreation of tissue on an increased speed. To prevent the tissue from turning into malignious tissue a 24/7 monitoring of the process is crucial"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Two things - one, Mad, I think that might be the way to go. I particularly like it 'cause it explains why I can't take my wounded guy who has 59 out of 60 wound points recovered on a mission...a fact which I presume stays in v1.0.

 

Second, so I feel like a bit of an arse. A person reading a few posts back will no doubt notice an apparent contradiction in my statements. What was meant by the "isn't the burn you get when you pull a pan off a stove" was just that it is a very, very serious burn, not that it was fundamentally different. It was actually a crappy comment, because I've seen some serious burns from hot water... So I apologize for the inconsistency and the discounting of scalds. I'll leave them there to remind me that I'm not perfect....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

somehow this reminds me of those tanks in Star Wars... what were they called? I can't remember... but I agree, this would be a nice way to explain several inconsistencies, including the fact that your soldiers can suffer something like 60 points of damage to the arm (out of 70 points the soldier has in total) and still be back in the field a month or so later on - with the arm fully functional and attached to the body.

 

perhaps in V1+ a medical bay could be included as a base facility - when you have one, your soldiers heal faster, when you don't have one, they have a higher probability of permanent damage.

 

for now, I'd say the medical regeneration stuff sounds good. perhaps it should be fully explained in the Field Medical Kit X-Net entry, and only hinted at here? then again, you might research the heavy plasma without ever researching the medkit. hmmm.

Edited by Moriarty
Link to comment
Share on other sites

perhaps in V1+ a medical bay could be included as a base facility - when you have one, your soldiers heal faster, when you don't have one, they have a higher probability of permanent damage.

Defintely should! I always thought it to be kind of ...strange that a super secret organization sends her soldiers with heavy plasma burns to the local hospital.... ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...