2 Player Campaign, When?

[gamebro]

---UPDATED July 12 2007---

 

 

If you don't wana read all this, here is a small quote to sum up my entire post----

 

"I am glad to see at least a multiplayer combat only version of x-com, but it is like having a small slice of a giant cheese cake!! I want soo much more! Without a campaign, the battles feel soo..... Pointless..."

 

 

-----------------------------------------------

First of all, hello fellow x-com enthusiasts. For the past 2 (now 3) years I have lurked in the dark, watching the slow progress of various x-com projects, and I believe UFO2000 has the best thing going for it (no offense to the other great projects) (and I still believe this is true even now,, another year later)

 

Before I present my questions about the UFO 2000 project, here is my X-com History-

-------------------

I was introduced to the wonderful world of X-Com via the playstation back in 1995 I think it was, and I played through the game on that consol about 3 times!!! Many years later I got to play through X-Com 2 on the PC (liked the first better, but still cool) then a few years later again, got to play X-Com Apocalypse (awesome game!)

I am currently playing x-com 1 (PC VERSION) this past week. And I must say I like it better then the PSX version, even though the PSX has slightly better graphics, cool new cutscenes, and awesome remixed x-com music (I have em all in MP3's) the PC version is much faster. (tactical battlescapes took about 1 minute to load in x-com 1 for PSX)

 

 

--------------------------------

I am wondering what the team is up to here? This project has hardly changed in the past year (now years), (as far as what is available for download) but I know the team must be working on something new and cool right?

 

The (long term) focus here seems to be on making a Massively multiplayer version of UFO 2000. And I think this is getting ahead of yourselves..... A 2 player campaign version of UFO 2000 should be worked on first before attempting something as bold as a MMORPG type of mode.

 

Is 2 player campaign currently the next goal for this project?

How cool would it be, to play against a friend who is controlling the Alien Race, building his own bases, researching earth bound creatures and locations, abduction people\cows for genetic material to manufacture his own alien hoards..... All while the human player is building up his X-com bases, technology, and manufactured goods. The 2 sides fight each other, in the normal full fledged campaign that would take anywhere from minutes to months to complete!

 

 

I'd think this would naturally be the 2nd goal of the UFO-2000 team, as the first goal is about complete (the combat), and to make a MMORPG mode would be much more difficult.

 

It should be the 3rd long term goal that a MMORPG mode be implemented IMO. Get the 2 player mode working properly before even dreaming that BIG.

 

Mod groups, ALWAYS get angry, when pestered for a release date, so I won't sink quite that low...... But...... Is there a 2 player campaign mode in the works? Something that goes beyond the disappointing combat only mode available right now. I say disappointing, cause it would break many X-COM fans' heart to download a multiplayer mod for X-COM only to learn there is no Geoscape, or economics involved.

 

The RPG, Economic, and Geoscape aspects of X-Com were very important in the games success. Now I know some here don't care about the geoscape, but you have to admit that MOST X-Com fans WOULD want that feature if they had a choice.

 

Full campaign Multiplayer with at least 1 friend...... This is the TRUE dream of anyone who has played any X-com game, am I right? So why is the focus not on this? Or is it?

If something like that is in the works...... Will we see it within the next year? Or will 5 years pass, and we will still only have a combat only mode?

Please don't take offense to my post, and I am glad to see at least a multiplayer combat only version of x-com (and it is cool) but it is like having a small slice of a giant cheese cake!! I want soo much more! Without a campaign, the battles feel soo..... Pointless...

 

 

Otherwise---- The Council of nations are pleased with your oustanding progress, keep up the good work. Funding change--- +7,190,101

Edited July 12, 2007 by gamebro

[gamebro]

BUMP!

 

Hey don't get mad about me bumping this, it has been almost a year since this thread was first posted

 

 

Soo..... Here we are.... Another year gone by... I am glad to see a newer version came out a few months back (haven't tried it yet though). I imagine there still isn't many people playing every day though? Kinda sad there isn't more of a buzz around this project on the internet, what with the UFO series sucking soo bad n all (ufo aftershock for example).

 

I guess it's fair to say that 2 player campaign (even a limited version) isn't ever gona happen huh? Pretty sad stuff, but I know, I know-- from the arguments here in the past, you guys don't give a $#!t about the geoscape, or don't think it'll add enough to warrant the time and effort it'd take to build, OR don't have the skill to build it, or you do care but just not that much yada yada blah blah....

 

But really, can't you guys just make something uber basic? Who says the geoscape even needs to be 3d? perhaps it could be a flat 2d screen with entirely different coding then what x-com uses? More like a board game map, and is much cheesier then what x-com uses (nodes or points of interest only)

 

 

Gamebro's ultra high res, super realistic UFO 2000 geoscape map----

 

======================== ,, would be turn based geo-

==xcom base 1=============,, -scape on a 2d map

=====+================== ,, much like HOMM 1-5

======================== ,, or master of magic

======================== ,, players take turns

==============alien base 3= ,, moving craft, building

==================*===== ,, bases, and managing

======================== ,, forces.

====crashed ufo 421========= ,, money is used to equip

========@=============== ,, and build, but options

======================== ,, are limited in intial release

 

 

Once a mission starts, a random map is chosen (from a prebuilt list of maps). If a base mission, a map from the "BASE" maps is chosen. Base's wouldn't even need to represnt what was actually built by the player, nor should there even be many base building options for the initial release.

 

Perhaps make a simple map screen, with NO real time. More like master of magic, or heroes of might and magic, the players take turns building bases, launching missions, ect. I really think you programmers should look into something basic like that, and build apon it a little bit with each release. You'd tap a much larger fan base if you did I think. Right now the game is just tacticle battle strategy, and that is only 1\2 of the x-com experience.

 

Don't think too big (like I tend to do), start out with a very limited and basic geoscape, and I think that will go a long ways into the future development of this feature. And believe me, if I knew anything about programming I'd love to try something like this, but truthfully I don't know #$*% about programming.

 

 

 

Or...... You can continue to concentrate on only building more to the battle scenes.... Heh, I'm glad work is still being done on this either way, but I personally have limited interest in it right now being that it is battles only and I think many other x-com fans feel the same way I do....

Well, I'll give the latest version a try later today (if you hate me, look to kick my butt ingame when I am on later tonight)

Edited July 12, 2007 by gamebro

[Guest Azrael]

BUMP!

 

Hey don't get mad about me bumping this, it has been almost a year since this thread was first posted

 

 

Soo..... Here we are.... Another year gone by... I am glad to see a newer version came out a few months back (haven't tried it yet though). I imagine there still isn't many people playing every day though? Kinda sad there isn't more of a buzz around this project on the internet, what with the UFO series sucking soo bad n all (ufo aftershock for example).

 

I guess it's fair to say that 2 player campaign (even a limited version) isn't ever gona happen huh? Pretty sad stuff, but I know, I know-- from the arguments here in the past, you guys don't give a $#!t about the geoscape, or don't think it'll add enough to warrant the time and effort it'd take to build, OR don't have the skill to build it, or you do care but just not that much yada yada blah blah....

Such comments are really unhelpful and very rude.

 

UFO2000 is done by these people on their free time, and to my knowledge there is only one (1!) active programmer (Natchwolf), ever tried making a game on your own? (this is assuming you have any programming experience, which is obvious by your post that you don't).

And I hate to tell you this, but Natchwolf as well as the rest of the UFO2000 team have lives, sad, sad, yes, I know, but it's true! how dare they! but hey, that's the way it is, should my plan to kidnap them and force them to work 24/7 on UFO2000 come to completion, I'll let you know.

 

Please use your head before you post. It's not that they don't give a damn about single player or geoscape, it's just that they are focusing on other stuff (not right now, they have lives, see above for the "they have lives" chapter of this post) and making a game is not easy, so, relax, and either stop being such an ungrateful and rude kid or go learn C++ and start helping yourself instead of asking others to do what you will not.

[gamebro]

Why is it that everytime I post my opinions I get a response like that?

 

 

Dude... SHUT UP!

 

 

I think I was politely asking what's going on, and why. Sounds to me like YOU are incapable of having a mature discussion or debate, and if so, don't open your mouth, because YOU are the one being extremely rude here. I am glad to see what has been done thus far, and by all means I hope more work is done in the future. I am not making any outrageous demands here, simply requesting. Your hostility is incredibly evil.

 

I KNOW they have lives, I KNOW this is hard work. I am mearly asking why and when. Is that soo fudging bad?

Edited July 12, 2007 by gamebro

[[dteviot]]

Don't think too big (like I tend to do), start out with a very limited and basic geoscape, and I think that will go a long ways into the future development of this feature. And believe me, if I knew anything about programming I'd love to try something like this, but truthfully I don't know #$*% about programming.

 

Or...... You can continue to concentrate on only building more to the battle scenes.... Heh, I'm glad work is still being done on this either way, but I personally have limited interest in it right now being that it is battles only and I think many other x-com fans feel the same way I do....

Well, I'll give the latest version a try later today (if you hate me, look to kick my butt ingame when I am on later tonight)

ROFL

Well, if you like the Geoscape, have a look at the XNA branch of Xenocode (plug, plug).

And speaking as the writer (most of) that code. I'll make the following points.

• In the Geoscape, the graphics are the smallest part of the work. If you look at it, it's 7 months of my spare time. The Rendering of the Geoscape was about 3 weeks.
  
• Of the people who look at the Xenocide, the number one complaint is "Why didn't you start with the battlescape? The battlescape is the best part of the game."
  

[gamebro]

XENOCIDE looks great, I've been following that for years now too, but no offense--- when will we finally have a playable version? I checked out the old 2005 (I think?) progress demonstration release with the working geoscape, and yeah it rocked. But since then there has been nothing new released to the public right?

[Guest Azrael]

Why is it that everytime I post my opinions I get a response like that?

 

 

Dude... SHUT UP!

 

 

I think I was politely asking what's going on, and why. Sounds to me like YOU are incapable of having a mature discussion or debate, and if so, don't open your mouth, because YOU are the one being extremely rude here. I am glad to see what has been done thus far, and by all means I hope more work is done in the future. I am not making any outrageous demands here, simply requesting. Your hostility is incredibly evil.

 

I KNOW they have lives, I KNOW this is hard work. I am mearly asking why and when. Is that soo fudging bad?

Because you type your opinions in a most rude form, that's probably the reason, now chill.

 

Edit: And you're not 'mearly asking why and when', you're saying: "from the arguments here in the past, you guys don't give a $#!t about the geoscape, or don't think it'll add enough to warrant the time and effort it'd take to build, OR don't have the skill to build it, or you do care but just not that much yada yada blah blah....", which is plain incorrect.

Edited July 12, 2007 by Azrael

[Popek]

I'm fairly new to ufo2k compared to some, but a long time x-com series fan who would love to see a project in this vein exist. However I'm hugely aware of the limitations, and the actually idea behind this game.

 

It's purpose is for quick pickup style matches, adding MMO elements in any aspect would essentially be a different game entirely and would need to be built nearly from the ground up. ufo2k already is limited to a skeleton crew of people working on it, and a handful of players around the globe.

 

Don't think too big (like I tend to do), start out with a very limited and basic geoscape, and I think that will go a long ways into the future development of this feature. And believe me, if I knew anything about programming I'd love to try something like this, but truthfully I don't know #$*% about programming.

 

^ is a bit of a gem in your post I to know very little in the way of programming, but I know enough to realize how massive the amounts of work this would entail. Currently the battlescape is still full of bugs and sync issues and those are far more important.

[Hobbes]

gamebro,

 

Requests are always welcome but trying to get people into motion on this project by teasing them (or stinging them with harsh words or similiar speech) is futile. I say this because I've tried that tactic before and at the very best you can set someone into motion but just 1 or 2 or 3 persons working on this isn't enough to kick start this project back into motion. Nachtwolf tried to do so on the past year (kudos to you dude) but people get frustrated and tired when working alone.

Right now he's a caretaker of the project, at least we have that. Perhaps sometime in the future several people, old and new, will join efforts together to complete the battlescape. But unless there's a pleasant surprise in the future, I wouldn't expect for it to happen.

 

On a post the other day I said that this project is moribund and the only place to go from here is death. Popek said that is a depressing thought and I completely agree, considering that I've been playing UFO2000 for 3 or 4 years. Still that doesn't change the current reality of this project: we can add new terrains or weapons but there's nothing more we can do or expect from it. There used to be at least 3 to 4 people every night on the server. Now when I connect I find none.

 

But I don't think I'll give it up completely. After all little grey creatures might exist and abduct people in the middle of the night in silver saucers.

[gamebro]

hobbes---

 

Well don't be fooled by Azrael, I wasn't trying to be overly rude, rather just pointing out that (especially in the past) there are some people here who don't give a Shiz about a 2 player campaign. Is that incorrect?

 

Don't you see hobbes? When you first came here, when you first played UFO 2000, were you not just a little bit disappointed to find out it was only the battles?

Of course there is hardly any players, there is no geoscape part to this!!! Do you have any idea the fanbase this project would have if it even had a limited and basic 2 player campaign!? I'd be playing a ton, and I am willing to bet (about 20 bucks) that tons of other X-com fans would be too! Every battle would mean something and work towards a goal.

 

I know this makes people angry (based on my past posting record here) but this project really is just a glorified version of X-COM EMAIL BATTLES... Yeah sure this is a mile or 2 beyond it, but still it is limited to battles only!..... So you beat your friend in a 1 on 1 match.... Whoopie! big deal, game's over... Move on.... It's only fun for soo long, and doesn't have that addicting (I'm achieving something) feeling that X-com has. Flame me for having that opinion if you must, but I stand firm on that belief, not because I hate this project, but because I know it could have been more then this.

If anyone here is going to hate me for this, or you might as well hate most EVERY x-com fan who discovers this site and sighs in disappointment when they find out it is only battles...... And I am sure it's many...

 

 

Sigh....... It makes me very sad to hear that hobbes, but perhaps it is true. This project really is dieing out now huh? =,(

Why wasn't there more people, is what kinda gets me... I know from the few times I've played, that yeah there was very few other players on... Even if only battles you'd think there'd be more then that considering how much of a hit the x-com series was. I guess everyone is too content playing there crappy BATTLEFIELDS and AGE OF EMPIRES, but I sure as heck ain't!

Older games like this had a magic gameplay that newer games today could never hope to achieve.

 

Soo I guess my suggestions are pointless then? If we are lucky we might see 1 or 2 more updates as the years progress and that's it for this whole project. Sheesh that is soo freaking sad. I really wanted to shoot down my brothers UFO, blast his snakemen to pieces in a battle, then sell the corpses for cash that I'd use to buy more bullets, but I suppose that will never happen?

 

Well... I am very depressed now. I'll try out the latest version of UFO 2000, but I guess I have little reason to suggest anything further now =\

 

If anyone wants to kick my a$$ in UFO2000 get on here in about 20 minutes. I suck pretty bad (haven't played in like 10 months) but I'll try my best to take as many of your units to heck with me as I can

Edited July 13, 2007 by gamebro

[Popek]

in relation to the 'lack of achievement' comment.

 

I've been dabbling with creating a 'campaign' system with players similar to how gamesworkshop titles are played.

Since this will involve a ruleset outside of the game itself, I want to run it with a small number of players, likely 4 to start with. Imagination being the driving force behind this, almost creating a bit of a storyline.

 

Something like this will take a fair bit of organization, and no it won't always be 'fair', but it should be fun and provide a sense of accomplishment (or loss) If anyone else is familiar with how games like Necromunda/Mordheim function, you're welcome to throw some ideas and comments my way. It would have to ride heavily on the honour system, and battle reports and replays would be submitted, and a match up system for the battles would occur combined with some progression for the teams.

 

Once I have this more thought out, I'll create a proper thread for this... sorry for the derail..

 

 

There used to be at least 3 to 4 people every night on the server. Now when I connect I find none.

 

There's a handful of us who choose not to play on the official server, let alone just idle on there until someone shows up, especially due to memory issues some people have. IRC is nicer, but people tend to use it the same way as the ufo server, and just show up for a minute, if nobody replies they leave... peeps gotta hang out more and chat !

[gamebro]

yeah I am in right now, I only see 3 players including me =\

 

I thought of doing a board game type play too once before. Me and my brother used to play in a LAN, and were gona use dice and monopoly money to play on a fake geoscape, with battles ingame but we gave up the idea before getting started. I think that yeah, with some sort of organizing and HONEST players, something fun like that could be drawn up.

[Hobbes]

Don't you see hobbes? When you first came here, when you first played UFO 2000, were you not just a little bit disappointed to find out it was only the battles?

 

First time I played UFO2000 I was not disappointed at all. By the contrary, I felt like a dream turned true. I had played the original game for more than 10 years and one of the few things that was missing from that game was the lack of a human opponent in battlescape. One who would set traps for you with explosives and prox mines. That would panic at the keyboard and run with its units across the map (oh, I still remember how much I laughed on that one...) before exiting the game.

 

Do you have any idea the fanbase this project would have if it even had a limited and basic 2 player campaign!? I'd be playing a ton, and I am willing to bet (about 20 bucks) that tons of other X-com fans would be too! Every battle would mean something and work towards a goal.

 

Yeah, for starters all the original X-COM players who use this and strategycore boards, some of them playing from even before I did, might finally be interested. Or not and prefer to keep to the original game (which still rules)

 

I know this makes people angry (based on my past posting record here) but this project really is jus[qt a glorified version of X-COM EMAIL BATTLES... Yeah sure this is a mile or 2 beyond it, but still it is limited to battles only!..... So you beat your friend in a 1 on 1 match.... Whoopie! big deal, game's over... Move on.... It's only fun for soo long, and doesn't have that addicting (I'm achieving something) feeling that X-com has.

 

Then you try facing your opponent with both sides only using sectoids armed with knifes. Or you make an all-female team (go girls go!). Or you play in a completely different terrain. Or you try to assassinate/capture/escape instead of deathmatch. So many options to try...

 

If anyone here is going to hate me for this, or you might as well hate most EVERY x-com fan who discovers this site and sighs in disappointment when they find out it is only battles...... And I am sure it's many...

 

I don't. But I also don't lose much sleep about disappointed X-COM players. It's their choice to make.

 

I really wanted to shoot down my brothers UFO, blast his snakemen to pieces in a battle, then sell the corpses for cash that I'd use to buy more bullets, but I suppose that will never happen

 

You are confusing UFO2000 with X-COM. This is a new game, based on the original, not a remake of the original. If Geoscape is ever finished the result will be much different from the original game.

[gamebro]

hobbes-

 

Well I am glad you are able to enjoy the variety offered by the battles, but you and people like you are a small breed (as evident by the sheer lack of players) so all that variety and nobody seems to care (no offense). Legions of hardcore x-com fanatics want more then just pointless battling. But you raise a good point...

 

You are not trying to build a close remake of X-com?..... Well just what the heck are you trying to build then!?!? A game only a few people will care to play?

Meh it doesn't matter either way. This project is injured and dieing like you say, and that is most unfortunate. Thank you for being honest and answering my questions hobbes... I mistook this place as being a fansite dedicated to delivering that full online x-com experience that never was....

 

 

Bah well, sucks to be an x-com fan then I guess.... Although I did find one tidbit of interesting news on a wiki article today---

 

"In 2005, Take Two Interactive acquired the rights to the X-COM series from Atari[1]. There are unconfirmed rumours that Irrational Games (who are owned by Take Two) may be developing a new X-COM title."

 

Interesting.... But chances are it'll be more like the UFO series then the X-com series, which means it'll suck.... If only the gallop brothers would make a new\better version of laser squad nemesis that had a geoscape type of play in addition to the cool tacticle battles, then guys like me wouldn't need to pester you people at all eh?

 

Ok, sorry to bother you fellows. Enjoy your game\project. I'll give up this silly dream and get back to some MMORPG or something =,(

Edited July 13, 2007 by gamebro

[[dteviot]]

XENOCIDE looks great, I've been following that for years now too, but no offense--- when will we finally have a playable version? I checked out the old 2005 (I think?) progress demonstration release with the working geoscape, and yeah it rocked. But since then there has been nothing new released to the public right?

http://www.xcomufo.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=242028056

http://www.xcomufo.com/forums/index.php?sh...0&start=150

 

At current rate of progress, about 6 weeks.

[Popek]

You are not trying to build a close remake of X-com?..... Well just what the heck are you trying to build then!?!? A game only a few people will care to play?

 

Ever play chess? consider ufo2k to be like chess. only you have at your disposal a variety of weapons, cover, graphics, etc... it's chess on crack cocaine... and it's fun. surprisingly, some people really enjoy pitting their wits against another player. I enjoy being destroyed by a more cunning opponent, I enjoy setting up a fantastic ambush, I enjoy pulling of an extremly lucky shot that saves one of my units from 'certain' death. The battlescape is the meat and potatoes of the game.

 

The geoscape, is another game, a game of monetary management at it's core. It doesn't transfer well or at all to the ufo2k mindset. If you want that, there are other games out there.

 

Like Hobbes mentioned, the battlescape has an entire slew of various ways to play. An abundance of terrains, weapon sets, scenarios... You're looking for something else, and you're barking up the wrong tree for it. What you're after would be nice, but it would be nice in another game.

 

Even your interpretation of my campaign idea/plan was skewed in a way that just... isn't ufo2k. It's X-com MMO. That's not the project here, it's something else, and it's trying to be good at what it does.

 

 

 

 

ps. if you wanna roll, hit up the irc channel irc.quakenet.org #ufo2000 . 10,000 points. ufo2k weapon set (both alien/human).

[Hobbes]

Well I am glad you are able to enjoy the variety offered by the battles, but you and people like you are a small breed (as evident by the sheer lack of players) so all that variety and nobody seems to care (no offense).

 

None taken. In fact I take it as a compliment: quality usually has an inverse relationship to quality,

[bamb]

I think what's hurting ufo 2000 the most now is the bugginess of the game. Both not getting it to work or crashes and gameplay unintuitive behaviour (every newbie has to learn the hard way that some things don't work like they seem at first.)

 

With battles lasting over one hour I don't think that many people would have the patience to actually finish that many ten- or twenty-battle geoscape games. It fits single player much better where you can play whenever you want and don't need to agree to any schedules. But it's not a sucky idea, I think just that you're overstating it a bit.

 

Playing vs the computer in ufo 1 was usually much faster since it was so stupid and also didn't take time to think.

Actually, my medium skill ufo game is currently in ice since I'm bored at the endless battles.

 

In ufo2k there is more variety since there are more weapons and tactics and it's more unpredictable because of human opponents.

 

 

That's not to say that a geoscape and full strategy gaming wouldn't be a welcome addition to ufo2000. It would be very nice too, if someone decided to make it!

[gamebro]

Yeah good points.... A full fledged campaign would take serious time (and a good save\load feature) to play through.... That wouldn't be a problem for me and my brothers though, we'd gladly play it that long, and I am sure there are many x-com fans who would.

 

But remember a basic campaign should be just that (basic). Starting out, aliens can only use very small or small ufo's carrying a max of 3 aliens at the start, with x-com being limited to craft that only carries 5-6, and all starting maps will be small ones (be a good way to keep the first few game months moving smooth and quicker). Steps could be taken to ensure a quicker game. Maybe even a time limit for each player much like how chess players play.

 

But yeah obviously, having a alien battleship with 25 aliens, and an x-com craft with 25 soldiers would spell certain doom for anyone on a tight time schedule !

 

All turn based strategy games that play online have the same issue though. Ever try to play heroes of might and magic online 1-5? It isn't pretty . Tis the only dark side to turn based strategy. perhaps simultaneous moving could work until a unit is spotted, but obviously that would be a very hard thing to build.

 

Gah! Why am I still talking. Non of this is ever gona happen. Back to RuneScape I go

 

 

(ps- I hate how on this forum, typing in automatically uses the laughing face emote)

Edited July 13, 2007 by gamebro

[Guest Azrael]

Yeah good points.... A full fledged campaign would take serious time (and a good save\load feature) to play through.... That wouldn't be a problem for me and my brothers though, we'd gladly play it that long, and I am sure there are many x-com fans who would.

 

But remember a basic campaign should be just that (basic). Starting out, aliens can only use very small or small ufo's carrying a max of 3 aliens at the start, with x-com being limited to craft that only carries 5-6, and all starting maps will be small ones (be a good way to keep the first few game months moving smooth and quicker). Steps could be taken to ensure a quicker game. Maybe even a time limit for each player much like how chess players play.

 

But yeah obviously, having a alien battleship with 25 aliens, and an x-com craft with 25 soldiers would spell certain doom for anyone on a tight time schedule !

Actually, once you'd code any kind of UFO carrying Aliens and coding the ability to engage it / attack it on the ground, a battleship would differ from a small UFO only in stats, and those take about 2 minutes to add

 

(ps- I hate how on this forum, typing in automatically uses the laughing face emote)

I hate it too <_<

[Exo2000]

Yeah good points.... A full fledged campaign would take serious time (and a good save\load feature) to play through.... That wouldn't be a problem for me and my brothers though, we'd gladly play it that long, and I am sure there are many x-com fans who would.

 

But remember a basic campaign should be just that (basic). Starting out, aliens can only use very small or small ufo's carrying a max of 3 aliens at the start, with x-com being limited to craft that only carries 5-6, and all starting maps will be small ones (be a good way to keep the first few game months moving smooth and quicker). Steps could be taken to ensure a quicker game. Maybe even a time limit for each player much like how chess players play.

 

But yeah obviously, having a alien battleship with 25 aliens, and an x-com craft with 25 soldiers would spell certain doom for anyone on a tight time schedule !

Actually, once you'd code any kind of UFO carrying Aliens and coding the ability to engage it / attack it on the ground, a battleship would differ from a small UFO only in stats, and those take about 2 minutes to add

 

I think he means in battlescape terms. It's a lot faster to do 10 shirtrookies going after 6 sectoids than 26 powergoons going after 30 mutons.

[Popek]

i read 'shirtcookies'

 

 

and i got hungry

[Exo2000]

i read 'shirtcookies'

 

 

and i got hungry

 

[gamebro]

Yep that is what I meant

20 x-com units vs 20 aliens would take a looooong time, though I'd enjoy it (especially alien base missions!)

 

 

Funny you call em "shirtcookies". I always called my new recruits "Alien Bait"

[Exo2000]

No, shirtrookies. As in "Rookie" or Recruit. Edited July 14, 2007 by Exo2000

[Guest Azrael]

Yeah good points.... A full fledged campaign would take serious time (and a good save\load feature) to play through.... That wouldn't be a problem for me and my brothers though, we'd gladly play it that long, and I am sure there are many x-com fans who would.

 

But remember a basic campaign should be just that (basic). Starting out, aliens can only use very small or small ufo's carrying a max of 3 aliens at the start, with x-com being limited to craft that only carries 5-6, and all starting maps will be small ones (be a good way to keep the first few game months moving smooth and quicker). Steps could be taken to ensure a quicker game. Maybe even a time limit for each player much like how chess players play.

 

But yeah obviously, having a alien battleship with 25 aliens, and an x-com craft with 25 soldiers would spell certain doom for anyone on a tight time schedule !

Actually, once you'd code any kind of UFO carrying Aliens and coding the ability to engage it / attack it on the ground, a battleship would differ from a small UFO only in stats, and those take about 2 minutes to add

 

I think he means in battlescape terms. It's a lot faster to do 10 shirtrookies going after 6 sectoids than 26 powergoons going after 30 mutons.

Well, he was talking about coding.

[Exo2000]

I see no mention of coding in that post, y'know. >_>

[gamebro]

Hmmm perhaps I worded it wrong.

 

 

What I mean is that yeah the geoscape part of this would allow you to build craft (bigger and bigger as the game progresses). The advantage to building larger craft is the ability to haul more units per mission (just how x-com does it already).

So as an example- A small alien scout would only let you take 2-3 alien units into a mission. X-com likely starts out only being able to buy small skyrangers that haul 6-8 units max (aliens are overpowered compared to x-com of course, thus the need for more x-com units).

 

Later on in this 2 player campaign, the alien player will probably have developed the tech to build a large scout, which can haul 4-5 aliens. Then Medium ships which carry 6-8, then Larges which carry 10-12, then very large 13-15, or alien base (20 max) or x-com base (25 max). Just an example of course, I'm sure there would need to be adjustments to all of this for it to be balanced and work.

 

 

Aliens GROW units, thus because of a population limit, they will have a need to send out missions to burn off excess troops. X-com buys them in bulk like normal, and looses funding if they opt not to fight off the alien threat.

[Exo2000]

The Skyranger's base capacity is 14, by the way. 3 HWPs + 2 Soldiers or whatever mix you choose.

 

Alien ships are, roughly (going on what I remember);

Small Scout: 1

Medium Scout: 4-5

Large Scout: 6-10

Others: 15-20+

[gamebro]

Yeah, a normal skyranger holds 14 right? Well in a 2 player online campaign it should be lowered to more like 6-8 to ensure quicker battles. Things would need to be changed for an online 2 player campaign to work smoothly and quickly, and this is just 1 example.

 

 

And actually I've had a large scout which had 12 alien units on it before (ethereals).

[Exo2000]

Yeah, a normal skyranger holds 14 right? Well in a 2 player online campaign it should be lowered to more like 6-8 to ensure quicker battles. Things would need to be changed for an online 2 player campaign to work smoothly and quickly, and this is just 1 example.

 

Problem is the people who continue to deploy with Skyrangers late into the game. Unlike Avengers, Skyrangers don't gulp Elerium for fuel, and with a cunning human opponent, Elerium will no doubt be much harder to come by! Sure, Skyrangers are vulnerable, but their fuel is/would be free, so there's no point in reducing their deployment effectiveness just for 'balance' reasons.

[JFarceur]

I guess it'll be time for designing new human ships. Example, the CloudRanger, given at the beginning of the game, would be a "shorter" version of the SkyRanger and can take less soldiers. For a much higher cost, SkyRangers are also available... but they cost more. "Number of soldier" issues could be dealed that way.

Also, we really should be able to fill an interceptor or firestorm with one single soldier, so that he can one-handedly care of an alien ship alone, if he's so good.

And be able to join 2 ships or more on a mission. So an avenger lands near a ship, then the sky ranger lands near too, and both team are together to kill the aliens. I missed that (MISSDAT ... you get it?) in the old game.

Aliens ship could gang too, like in a base construction. All the aliens ships should land in the same map, so it could be a giant... festival of killing everything.

 

Anyways.

[Kratos]

I can relate to wanting a Xcom mmo style of game play, and so can others. It just might turn up that way, nobody knows right now. However, you must understand that this project isn't trying to achieve the Xcom remake goals as other projects. It's based upon Xcom, so there will always be mods that support it. This tends to open a door up to be almost identical to what you are asking for.

 

And yes, Ufo2k is kind of silent right now. This doesn't mean it is dead. From its history, this is just a natural cycle. We are bound to have new developers and old ones returning.

 

Look I understand you want certain things to come out of Ufo2k, so does the rest of us. We developers are still working behind the scenes to continue this project. I myself am working on something, and it doesn't concern add-ons, although I am not just ready to say what yet. Please, stop being overly dramatic, everything is going to be fine.

Edited August 10, 2007 by Kratos

[gamebro]

Ok Kratos..... At least you've given me a little faith to go on here. I view 2 player campaign as vital, and I just kinda feel that most people here don't even care, or believe it can even happen, ya know?... The lack of players is depressing, and I think even a basic campaign could really help turn this around.

Either way, I am very glad to hear SOMEONE is still working on it, and has plans for a future release, I just hope this project finds even more help and new life some day! X-Com fans really still don't have anything else to turn too IMO, especially for a 2 player campaign X-comish like game

[The_Funktasm]

I was a bit upset that there wasn't regular play (single, story), but I like what is going on with this project. You just need better advertising is all.

 

Also, I call my un-armored rookies "Red-Shirts."

[Kratos]

You just need better advertising is all.

Not sure where you mean. What linked you here?

[Popek]

a google search most likely.

 

it does bring up a valid point, perhaps not related to this threads original topic, but it can evolve.

 

If growing the community is of a concern at this point, checking out the website hit statistics and finding out

just where the majority of visitors are coming from could benefit things. I know ufo2000 has been mentioned in several

retro gaming related articles, but not for some while. Now that there is a more enticing website, and another update release perhaps getting the word beyond these forum walls is not a bad thing.

[Guest Azrael Strife]

Personally, I'd wait until some vital issues are dealt with first. Namely, the GUI of UFO2000 is just plain horrorific and is most likely one of the main reasons it keeps people at bay, it's just not user friendly and frankly very ugly. If you start advertising a game that basically looks the same as it has always looked, people will probably overlook the new features and continue being put off by the overall look of the game, in short: advertising now will be useless. Edited September 30, 2007 by Azrael Strife

[Popek]

with years of marketing experience at hand, advertising is never useless.

 

just less effective

Edited October 1, 2007 by Popek

[Guest Azrael Strife]

with years of marketing experience at hand, advertising is never useless.

 

just less effective

It can also be negative, if you attract people's attention claiming new features and new this and that and they see basically the same ugly game as before, they'll probably ignore further attempts to gain their attention, that's what I'd do anyway.

[gamebro]

(hey guys, I've been away for a few months)----

 

I agree with Azrael a bit, that the interface should be simpler to use. I was completely lost trying to setup a game my first few times, and for a while it DID turn me away.

 

My recommendation, is a quick play option from the front page, with limited and EASY options.... Advanced players will still be able to use the normal setup, but this quick insta play will get noobs into the main game quicker and not utterly lost.

I feel sorry for people who've never played X-Com, then play this before trying any of the old games first. It might scare them away from it all together.

 

But in a little defense to Popek--- He is not totally wrong.... I mean how often do we see updates? How long until the interface is cleaned up? If not advertise now, then the serious question has to be asked "when do we advertise?" =\

 

 

I am glad to see a new update finally, the crysallids were always something I wanted in ufo2000 (now the terror really begins!). Thanks to everyone who is still working with this project! I like the new front page, but WHERE IS THE LINK TO THESE FORUMS? I had to search on google to find these forums, as I could not find a link on the new main page.

 

otherwise---

I am still unchanged in my opinions, that this game really and badly needs some form of 2 player campaign. It is vital IMO =D

 

 

Now if you'll excuse me, I am going to see what the heck, if anything, is going on with the Xenocide camp (if they have something playable I will wet myself =)

And if not, I'll have to give the latest version of UFO2000 a try.