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Still 1999?


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#1 Nickisimo

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Posted 25 June 2003 - 06:42 AM

I was just curious, and this has probably been covered already...but are we updating the start of the alien invasion from Dec 1998(1999? *shrug*)? If so, then we could add some different things to weapon info and whatnot from events that have passed since that time(9/11, the war in Iraq, etc).

I think starting the alien invasion slightly into our current future perhaps 2006 or something would be a nice touch, or maybe we should just eliminate the timeline altogether. I just finished watching T2 again for the first time since I was like 12 and I kinda laughed at the August 29, 1997 nuking(not because of the mass destruction, mind you.) I just found that the dating kinda seemed strange. And making a game based on 1999(I graduated High School that year...and I never noticed any aliens...) would be kinda lame. Anyways, just some thoughts while I'm wasting time here at work. :happybanana:

#2 GreatGold

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Posted 25 June 2003 - 07:10 AM

Hey -

The general concensus at the moment, is to have all the dates in the game adjust to the individual players computer time, plus 10 years. Or something to that effect.

In terms of updating weapons, we have two ways of doing this. The first is with the Creative Texts, and the second is with v1.0+ improvements. To explain better, within the technology and item entries, if the players read them, the weapons will seem very advanced. However, in terms of game-play and balance, they will be the same as X-Com for the most part. THis could easily be explained away with "Yes, we are advanced, but even are usper futuristic weapons and advancements still bounce off the aliens until we start using their own tech against them."

If you are talking about things like Night Vision and Thermal Imaging, scopes to increase accuracy, etc... these are all being looked at for post v1.0 releases.

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#3 Nickisimo

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Posted 25 June 2003 - 07:20 AM

Right, I was just thinking of a more down-to-earth description when talking about something like the basic combat rifle.

For example: "The mainstay of the U.S. and some NATO forces since the early 1990s, the Colt(probably can't use Colt) M16A2 Assault Rifle provides reasonable stopping power and a quick rate of fire while maintaining good accuracy in short bursts. Its light weight and ability to withstand the worst of weather conditions make it an ideal choice for a global combat unit. The M16A2 proved its dominance again during the Second War in Iraq(2003), where it was far superior to the Soviet designed AK-47."

Something along those lines. Obviously for advanced technology like Laser Weapons and whatnot we would have to come up with things, and alien artifacts would need a little creative story of their own. :happybanana:

#4 GreatGold

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Posted 25 June 2003 - 07:30 AM

Oh man... :D

I suggest you check out the CTD Asset List. I think it will open your eyes a little. In terms of basic human tech, check out Fred the Goat's entry for Xenocide Standard Issue Battle Dress Uniform.

Keep in mind that Xenocide will not be the "basic combat unit". If anything, they are the best the world has to offer, and as such, recieve the best equipment the world has to offer. This is reflected in the entries.

Also, the rifle entry is based on the OICW and is almost complete. Think of an OICW, minus the HE launcher, on crack. Its a good read, and makes scientific/engineering sense as well.

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#5 j'ordos

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Posted 25 June 2003 - 07:42 AM

Yes, X-Com should use the most advanced weaponry available. Something that has bugged me since the first episode however, is that you're supposed to start out with the best soldiers humanity has to offer, yet they can't hit an elephant 10 metres away at first. IMHO it would make more sense that your soldiers can hit practically everything you tell them to shoot, it just would barely scratch an armored alien...
But that wouldn't be very practical or fun I'm afraid :whatwhat:
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#6 Guest_Jim69_*

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Posted 25 June 2003 - 08:39 AM

Not really. U've probably heard about or read Bravo Two Zero, one of my fav books, and McNab is in the SAS and he was saying that on a range they could hit a target perfectly from 300m away every time, but in combat factors like heavy breathing and sweat in the eyes dramatically effect aim even lying down.

All I'm saying is that just coz they are the best in the world, doesn't mean that they will hit something everytime in combat, it's just not pratical. Plus he only had poorly trained Iraqies after his patrol, imagine how much more paniced ud be if an alien with superior firepower was comin against ya :crying:

Edit: Oops missed out a word, made it look VERY strange :hammer:

#7 Nickisimo

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Posted 25 June 2003 - 09:17 AM

Yeah I think that going against aliens would definitely cause a few problems for our world's best soldiers. We also have to assume that becuase it's turn-based, if it were a real simulation, the alien wouldn't be standing in the middle of a park like a dope, he'd probably be running or ducking for cover. And in time, the X-Com troops learn to shoot at them better.

All in all, I think the original skill level of the troops is fair. It's easy enough to assign tasks to your rookies based on their abilities. My favorite job is (Sct) - Scout. Take the greenies with the worst ratings and have them act as spotters. More often than not they get carried home in body bags, but they're the greatest heroes of all...
:boohoo:

Off the subject, I hope the player models will show better equipment sprites. Whenever they were carrying a heavy plasma or blaster launcher it looked like they were walking around with a loaf of bread. :happybanana:

#8 mikker

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Posted 25 June 2003 - 09:48 AM

well, I am not gonna eat that blaster bomb!

:explode:

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#9 Nickisimo

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Posted 25 June 2003 - 09:59 AM

"Look, private. We know there's a bunch of Mutons in that Control Center. We need you to go in there and draw their fire for us so we can take them out. We'll be right behind you. Here let me hold that rifle for you...you won't need it." :unsure:

#10 Deimos

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Posted 25 June 2003 - 10:40 AM

I'll agree with Jim in that combat shooting and range shooting are indeed two different beasts. Range shooting is all about low heart rate controlled accuarcyand no one is poing a rifle at you. Combat on the other hand is adrenaline fuelled fog of war theres a bunch of guys over there trying their level best to kill you.

I used to teach range shooting at summer camp way back and I used to regularly do paintball as well. The excitement/fear, adrenaline rush, keeping low moving fast and stealthily in paintball is I'd guess only a fraction of what it's like in real combat, I can understand how tough it is to be a soldier fighting against another human opponent. Factor in humanities in built xenophobia and it must be a really intense situation to be in. I can understand fully why they don't hit targets.

I wouldn't be surprised if xenocide operatives have a high Post traumatic stress disorder rate after the war.

#11 Nickisimo

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Posted 25 June 2003 - 10:49 AM

Just another good reason to add heartbeat sensors. :D
That'd be neat if the ECG actually showed the beats getting faster as the soldier's morale dropped. I know I'd be a little excited if a flying frisbee just shot a green beam at me. :whatwhat:

#12 Deimos

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Posted 25 June 2003 - 10:53 AM

The monor trouble with a heartbeat sensor would be that it would interfere with the other sounds in battlescape. However having it available when clicking on the stats page would work as it'd give an aural reference to how the soldier was feeling without interrupting the other sounds.

#13 Nickisimo

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Posted 25 June 2003 - 10:55 AM

Well the ECG doesn't have to make sounds. Rainbow Six is a good example of that. :happybanana:

#14 revenant4

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Posted 25 June 2003 - 06:46 PM

Well the ECG doesn't have to make sounds. Rainbow Six is a good example of that.  :happybanana:

Took the words right out of my mouth...no noise sensor...or make a toggle in the option screen to turn it off or on...

#15 stoopher

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 05:37 AM

I'l like to see soldier monitors transmitted directly back to the drop ship where the Gamer's character has option to watch from different soldiers view points and command them as appropriate.

Perhaps the only view point should be camera drones and soldier headsets, along with heartbeat data. Can monitor the low pulse rate when under alien control. the subconcious blips etc.

There's plenty of room for making this a new avenue of excitement.

#16 Breunor

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 06:04 AM

hehe,

Yeah those are all good ideas for making the date about 10 years after teh actual system time on the players PC. :D

btw, 1st person view will be looked at after v1 comes out. a multiplayer version of the game could eventually get down to each player controlling one soldier in combat, similar to a FPS game. Then you could really ramp up the details like people are mentioning.

#17 Nickisimo

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 06:26 AM

That'd be really crazy...like SOCOM with but with a side of alien. Of course, this sort of thing would push the V1.0+ release date to about the year 2025, but if we're all old men with kids and whatnot, what else are we going to have to do? Maybe we could even talk to the SONY people about releasing the software for their upcoming PS9... :happybanana:

#18 warhamster

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 09:24 PM

i like the idea of a heart beat monitor on soldiers. just flavor to monitor the guys morale. we can actually put that in instead of the purple morale bar.

I used to bring greenies on my mission's as spotters. if they survived long enough to make it to the top, then I kept. my only criteria to go on mission was that the greenie had to have bravery of 40 and up. i failed to screen of one guy and buy the time i noticed he was panickable, he was already an 81 TU guy with 75 accuracy. :blink:

#19 j'ordos

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 04:29 AM

Yeah I know I overdid that one, about hitting everything. It was just a small (ok maybe not so small :D ) They're suppposed to be ultra-trained but they still (can) improve 100% over time, which seems rather much.

I don't really mind them missing, although shooting a round in a civilian 10's of meters away can be frustrating at times. Hitting another alien than the one you aimed for OTOH can be quite fun!

Edited by j'ordos, 27 June 2003 - 04:31 AM.

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#20 Nickisimo

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 05:56 AM

Yeah, I think we've all been on a night mission and had Ol' Johnny Missalot firing a snap shot with his remaining TU's at an angry Snakeman only to fire past him into the darkness and then the beam hits an unseen alien and we hear that wonderful croaking sound. :rock:

About spotters, sometimes these guys can become your best troops if you use them exclusively for UFO raids and whatnot and they live. Some of my finest soldiers were once just cannon fodder that climbed the ranks. Only then when they prove themselves do I bother giving them armor and put them in a more protected role(Skyranger patrol?), while the fresh meat gets to do his/her old job.

"Go on private, over that hill...ZAP...ok good he missed, keep going, we can't see him yet...ZAP...SCREAM...THUD. *turns to remaining troops* Ok, now we know where he is...move out!" :happybanana:

#21 warhamster

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 03:39 PM

Haha! that sounds exactly like how i play. the rookies must be saying, thank god for the hoover tank! even more to the point, thank you avenger!!!!!

#22 Deimos

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 07:23 PM

V1.0+ release date to about the year 2025, but if we're all old men with kids and whatnot, what else are we going to have to do? Maybe we could even talk to the SONY people about releasing the software for their upcoming PS9... :happybanana:

Hah, Kids today. I don't know about the rest of you but that describes me just about right. ^_^

I wouldn't talk to $ony about their weird hardware. The pc is the best place for games like xcom as most console owners don't have the patience for a game like xcom.

#23 Guest_Jim69_*

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 07:58 PM

True, I own a console as well, but only play it when I'm drunk/stoned/extremly bored, I use the PC for more thought provoking games. Which is why (as far as I know) X-Com 1 fell flat on its arse on the PS1

#24 warhamster

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 09:30 PM

In defense of the PS1, I loved Castlevania: SOTN. And the Parasite Eve Series. The latter was a real thought provoking game with a thick story to boot. And let's not forget Metal Gear Solid.