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Government Trading?


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#1 Sectopod

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Posted 16 December 2005 - 06:07 PM

I've just had a thought right now :P

You know how X-Corps gets their research from ANY military and civilian research center right, well some of this could be accessed, but I bet the American government doesn't really want X-Corps to access to the really secret Government files back down in Area 51...

So what I propose is that the Governments stick their nose into X-Corps' business in alien physiology and downed alien craft. It all starts when either a UFO has been downed but has been left alone on the turf for too long.. in which the army's special forces takes it into their own hands.. and ships it to a quiet research base, or when a Terror site is ignored, and the government kill the aliens and recover the items.. or anything you can really think of if X-Corps can't get off their backside.

They:

1) Do it for power, making their country have big secrets (and an advantage over others).
2) Respectable trading with the X-Commander.

After a while, if you had left the ufos and aliens to their own tricks, a secret government agent will approach you, and tell you of a new project they have made that could interest you.. the cost? Oh a friendly trade of your research for theirs seems fair, or lets say an order of 200 Plasma Rifles, or a tonload of Xenium.

Lets say the government made an anti-alien toxin, like a gas that kills any aliens it breaths, and they would offer it for you for, oh... only your Alien Alloys tech. You can either accept or turn them away. Accepting this enables more shady research with the government (and an increase in respect) or turn them away.

The government will then try to research other branches of alien technology from the ones you have given them.

The government after researching this by itself will:

Update it's troops. Alien Alloys will make NPC Marines of that government more harder. They could even have customised battlesuits as their versions of your Power Suits. Shows how different research branches show up different varieties.

Update it's weapons. The Toxin launcher for example will be carried into battle by NPC Marines who will use this on aliens.

Update it's craft. If the government has craft, then it will update them with newer ships. Ever seen an alienified alloyed MIG?

This has good sides and downsides:

The good sides is that the NPC's who aid you in battle are more suited to killing their enemy. Also the government could ally with you if you give them enough respect.

Or.. the government could become infiltrated if they research too deeply (An Ethereal Terror Site left alone, who woke up in a lab and well went loose), or they could pull out from X-Corps altogether, not allying with no sides at all if they have reached a point where they can fend for themselves.

There could be cases where the government had pulled out from X-Corps and you can raid the lab of one of the government's to take the technologies, but caution, past transactions could make them have updated technology. Walking into a room with Power Suits only to run into Alien Alloyed Marines and a reverse engineered Sectopod could ruin an X-Commander's day. Such an action would be hostile, they could ally with the aliens only to stab them in the back har har. Or even more funnier, you get to Cydonia and guess what? "Sir, you ain't gonna believe this, but you know that British reverse engineered Sectopod we fought in a raid? Well I hate to break this to you.. but theres six of them!, and other troops too on the red planet!"

Guess all that Stargate NID got to my head ^_^

Edited by Chmmr, 16 December 2005 - 06:18 PM.


#2 kashyyk

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 05:21 AM

Brilliant!
:ar15: :shockwhore:
US army............ You

#3 gu35s

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 05:56 AM

Agree. That's brilliant!

I can imagine while playing tactical and suddenly an army chopper fly across the screen then land on a clearing or rooftop. A bunch of marines were realeased and X-Command send a message to the agents, "We are told not to get involved any further by the Goverment. Return to the Condor (Skyranger) immediately and do not salvage anything. Doing other than that will be considered a breach of command by the Goverment." Then after two or three turns, the marines were outrun by the aliens and the game is on again :P Well, that is if the marines haven't have harden suits yet :)

Oh, and I can also imagine X-Corps have to fight stationary defense gun within the Goverment's lab. That would be so cool. "FIRE IN THE HOLE!" *BANG* "Damn, they are using the alien composite's (alien alloy) technolgy very well."

Boy, that would be fun :D
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#4 GARAK

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 05:05 PM

Interesting idea. One power having too much technology while another does not may lead to WWIII however. You would have to disperse the tech evenly to prevent it.

#5 Snakeman

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 07:33 PM

It sounds like an interesting fallout concept with relation to government manufacturing requests made upon X-COM. All supporting nations for X-COMs goals will undoubtedly have their own agendas apart from their common one of defeating the aliens after all. It seems in this kind of case that Garak would be right - these guys could get jealous despite this fact if you've fullfilled more requests to a particular ally than them.

But your in a pickle in that you've got limited manufacturing capacity and you have to decide based on the requests made which ones you could fulfill in time - and its probably one of the only solutions to counter this jealousy factor in your allies apart from doing successful missions that transpire on their turf. One thing that can placate these guys to an extent is to sell the spoils of missions done in their territory back to them.

Mountains of money could go a long way too for those nations left out the most.

Edited by Snakeman, 28 August 2006 - 07:34 PM.


#6 gu35s

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Posted 28 August 2006 - 11:38 PM

Somehow it becomes more of a business & political management game to me. Of course it wouldn't be so bad since when I was replaying, and have all my research done, I basically have nothing else to do than to wait for a UFO or more funding. So having "requests" from the goverment would be a nice change. Like the goverment "lost" captured aliens and claimed that they "found" a terror zone. Or the aliens took over the base and the goverment claim that they found an alien base. Though when the basescape started, the view would be more of a high tech human facility and the goverment would somehow change the story to "X-Corps attack one of our bases!" if X-Corps failed to finish the job, or "Here's some extra funding. That didn't happen." if X-Corps did their job. But either way, player would have constant action rather than sitting and waiting bored.
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#7 Snakeman

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Posted 29 August 2006 - 02:47 AM

Yeah that's basically it, something to do between UFO sightings, and in some situations maybe other factors could generate battlescape sites to load for different reasons.

Anyway, I don't think it'd be hard at all in terms of execution of manufacturing requests. For one thing if you can set the storage thresholds by personal preferences to allow for spares, anything the game recognizes as going over it is either something to be auto-sold for you indiscriminately, or in the case of any manufacturing requests still pending, items will split off into those instead and be sold.

The other thing of course is whether you can have multiple projects going simultaneously or not based on people and workspace taken up. That way you can stipulate a percent of people working on stuff to be sold, people who only replace small quantities for spares you'll want, and those fulfilling orders.

Something slightly off topic, but since space will probably be at a premium, I think there should be hybrid modules - For example, if I don't plan to have more than 120 people at my base (soldiers, engineers and scientists total), instead of having 30 unused bunks between 3 living quarters - have some kind of default where the game would take over that space for storage. Every little bit helps.

#8 GARAK

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Posted 30 August 2006 - 04:45 PM

It would become a kind of political simulator. It could always be somewhat optional. On the easy difficulty levels the governments don't act realistically or something.
Oh yeah, Snakeman just reminded me of something. Basic equipment should be stored in the living quarters. What do they have lockers for if they keep everything in the storeroom. My friend in the army had to keep his gear in his locker, and when he moved off-base he kept it in his garrage.

Edited by GARAK, 30 August 2006 - 04:46 PM.


#9 gu35s

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Posted 30 August 2006 - 05:29 PM

Make sense. Maybe instead of keeping it in the locker, it's probably kind of hard to program a seperate storing place. Instead, in the soldier menu, players can equip specific weapons for specific units and that will be the locker storage. So even the transport craft only bring extra things that maybe useful for the mission. And when player see the equip scene before a battlescape mission, the pre-set weapons are already equiped into the soldier, and the additional backpack and belt will always empty and unequipable (probably easier to just not have it at all) until before a mission. Additional items in the craft will be equiped then.

Now back to the topic. I was thinking that maybe the goverment can ask X-corps help for, say, terrorist erradication. Remember apocalypse where you can raid a building? Maybe this is similar where the government found a terrorist or alien worshipper cell and asked X-corps to finish them. Also maybe the terrorist would be raiding a government lab or alien tech storage and X-Corps "need" to help. In this case, a third (or forth counting the government) faction can be in the game. The more the player let the terrorist groups raid and capture alien tech, the harder it is for the next time. And maybe if the terrorist groups ARE alien worshipers, they can even attack X-Corps' Base with alien tech. Simple terrorist armoury maybe something like lining a chain of alien composites on the shirt to make a simple kevlar, using plasma weaponaries they captured, covering their transport with alien composites, adding Xenium fragments into homemade explosives, etc.

So if this case is available, the trading with goverments have a side effect other than being hated by opposing countries. The more you give/trade the government alien tech plus terrorist raids will cause X-Corps to have more problems than just the aliens. Although come to think of it, when players sell alien tech for more storage, don't the players selling it to government anyway? Or even if selling is to a private sector, they should be able to use them too. I mean, where do all the stuffs you sold gone to?
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#10 Snakeman

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Posted 31 August 2006 - 05:52 AM

Maybe instead of keeping it in the locker, it's probably kind of hard to program a seperate storing place. Instead, in the soldier menu, players can equip specific weapons for specific units and that will be the locker storage


A separate locker isn't necessary like you say. Essentially what "locker" could mean is what a trooper can carry on them. Being capable of equipping them beforehand I think would allow for freeing up the 80 item limit on transports to a big degree. I mean, if it was what they carried + the 80 item limit, then you've got much more breathing room equipment wise. Even more if we could factor in HWPs that can have extra space on them too for some small arms or clips. This whole process could be made easier, again by implimentation of a template system (for troop hiring/screening out, tanks and crafts - which also includes stat thresholds you prefer on a soldier besides weapon and item distribution to them.).

I mean, where do all the stuffs you sold gone to?


I think its a good idea along these lines to have other identifiable, if not playable separately, factions. Not only in terms of who you'd support, but who'd support you right back because you'd taken possitve actions in missions or in the distribution of wealth in other ways.

I don't think there should be a heck of a lot of scripted linear bits in these things involving governments or resistance cells beyond a kind of mission terminal type thing where you choose what to respond to. I agree with Garak though, that the more robust a system like this could become, its prudent to limit it to certain difficulty levels if politics becomes major to winning or not.

I personally think it should help but shouldn't be an overriding factor. I'm still a big fan of NKF's idea on still going on in a losing gaming scenario where no matter how diminished you are, you could still form a comeback through different methods - its just a question of as long as you have X, Y, and Z capability, you can continue (in this case, troops, guns, and transports & fuel - ok four things).

When things get dire market wise, too many governments converted to the alien side, all the economy has to do is shift from a money system to a barter/trading one.

Edited by Snakeman, 31 August 2006 - 06:00 AM.


#11 GARAK

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Posted 07 September 2006 - 02:09 PM

Yes instead of printed money they could use bottlecaps. Survivors could live in the underground xcorp bases or "vaults" - as long as they packed a few extra water chips...

#12 Snakeman

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Posted 07 September 2006 - 08:37 PM

Yea, it'd be an extension to the manufacturing missions for governments idea. Your either making stuff to kind of gift these guys with or your trading something you have for something they have. There could be all kinds of combinations of things that make up a trade too. One way may depend on manufacturing ability, but another way to try to fulfill stuff is the things you get on missions and raiding.