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#1 x0563511

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 09:15 AM

Im figuring out how to use the map editor, but i cant figure out how to make new, blank maps. The online help (diashivas site) says to right click on the catagory (UFO-Ships -> Alien) but that does nothing...

Also, there appears to be some junk entries that dont make sense (the ufos are completely screwed up. Specifically, UFO_000, UFO_010, and UFO_01a. What are these? (Note, i have xcomutil installed)

Another question... Once i save the edited ufo (say i modified the scout ufo) does it just show up ingame like that? If not, how do i import it?

Note, dont bother telling me about TFTD stuff, i dont bother with it. Cant stand all the bugs (most specifically the research tree problems)

Edited by x0563511, 31 July 2004 - 09:17 AM.


#2 Blehm 98

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 09:35 AM

you click on aliens, ships, and which ufo you want to edit. And yes, it does automatically show up ingame if you save it
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#3 j'ordos

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 10:24 AM

Im figuring out how to use the map editor, but i cant figure out how to make new, blank maps. The online help (diashivas site) says to right click on the catagory (UFO-Ships -> Alien) but that does nothing...

Also, there appears to be some junk entries that dont make sense (the ufos are completely screwed up. Specifically, UFO_000, UFO_010, and UFO_01a. What are these? (Note, i have xcomutil installed)

Another question... Once i save the edited ufo (say i modified the scout ufo) does it just show up ingame like that? If not, how do i import it?

Note, dont bother telling me about TFTD stuff, i dont bother with it. Cant stand all the bugs (most specifically the research tree problems)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

to add new maps, click 'edit' (next to 'file' :) ) then 'paths', and there you should see a 'map files' tab, there you can add new maps/categories by right clicking
The messed up UFOs are not used by the game anymore, some leftovers like you have in apoc :)

Edited by j'ordos, 31 July 2004 - 10:26 AM.

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#4 x0563511

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 12:48 PM

ok, got that far...

Next Question: Could you explain what the different 'spawn' nodes mean? Like 1:Spawn or 3:Spawn? I assume difficulty level...

If i make a new map from scratch, does it ever get used it game? or only if i replace or edit an existing one?

If so, i can 'delete' a default one, create a new one from scratch using the old ones name, and it will use that right? I want to make the small (the 4 point) UFO a double decked scout (the single room one, not the 'escape pod' like ship)... would that work?

#5 x0563511

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 12:53 PM

One more quick one:

Is there a 'fill'-like command? Lets say i want a big section with the same floor tile... Can i apply the same tile slot (like ground, west, north, object) to a range of tiles? Right clicking on every tile gets irritating...

Ive tried a bunch of different ways but so far nothing has done it

#6 j'ordos

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 01:15 PM

ok, got that far...

Next Question: Could you explain what the different 'spawn' nodes mean? Like 1:Spawn or 3:Spawn? I assume difficulty level...

If i make a new map from scratch, does it ever get used it game? or only if i replace or edit an existing one?

If so, i can 'delete' a default one, create a new one from scratch using the old ones name, and it will use that right? I want to make the small (the 4 point) UFO a double decked scout (the single room one, not the 'escape pod' like ship)... would that work?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think it's still unclear what those numbers actually do, perhaps someone does know tho...

you have to replace an existing one, else it won't get used in the game. Deleting a default one and using that name for a new one will work, yes. But, since you are using xcomutil, there is a possibility to use multiple maps, for example, that double decked scout (which is entirely possible, btw) ,if you still want to use the original one as well, you could create a new map with the new ship, name it UFO_NEW or something :) , put the .map and .rmp file in the correct folders, and then edit 'xcomutil.rnx'. there you should see the filenames of every UFO. then you just fill in the filename of your replacement map (UFO_NEW) after the filename of the original one (UFO_110). This would give : UFO_110 UFO_NEW. Then xcomutil will select one of those two everytime you get a medium scout. Check xcomutil.txt for more details.

One more quick one:

Is there a 'fill'-like command? Lets say i want a big section with the same floor tile... Can i apply the same tile slot (like ground, west, north, object) to a range of tiles? Right clicking on every tile gets irritating...

Ive tried a bunch of different ways but so far nothing has done it

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, filling is entirely possible, in the topview, just hold the mouse button while selecting the tile, and select the area you want to fill. Then you just select the tile you want to use (like you would normally do) and then press the edit button in the topview window, which contains the 'fill' option.
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#7 Hobbes

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 01:37 PM

ok, got that far...

Next Question: Could you explain what the different 'spawn' nodes mean? Like 1:Spawn or 3:Spawn? I assume difficulty level...

If i make a new map from scratch, does it ever get used it game? or only if i replace or edit an existing one?

If so, i can 'delete' a default one, create a new one from scratch using the old ones name, and it will use that right? I want to make the small (the 4 point) UFO a double decked scout (the single room one, not the 'escape pod' like ship)... would that work?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


A 3.Spawn will have bigger changes of spawning an alien than a 1.Spawn. The highter the number the bigger the probability.

As long as you maintain the original dimensions of each map (length vs. width) the game will accept them with no problem. There seems to be no problems changing the height but I'm not 100% sure on this.

#8 x0563511

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 02:35 PM

I would assume changing the hight would be OK, so long as i did the nodes correctly... I mean, the game never puts anything on top of UFOs...

Come to think of it, UFOs half-buried in a mountainside would be pretty cool!


I really should take closer looks at the menus of new programs... A good habit ive been drifting out of for some reason...

Thanks for all the help, ive been wanting to make some funky UFOs...

I'll probably have some quesitons about the nodes later (linking and such) when i get to them, but im gona design the ships themselves first.


Ive got an idea for some crazy medium scout (wont be medium anymore, but wont have much actual room inside... Ill post a pic when done)

#9 j'ordos

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 03:07 PM

changing height never gave problems for me, so I assume it's alright to change it. It's probably just something to reduce filesize (setting it to something lower than 4, that is :) ), which was important when it was made.

Thanks for clearing the spawn thingy up Hobbes :beer:
any chance you also know what the 'flags' do? And the misc1/2 ranks?

Edited by j'ordos, 31 July 2004 - 03:08 PM.

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#10 Hobbes

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 03:46 PM

changing height never gave problems for me, so I assume it's alright to change it. It's probably just something to reduce filesize (setting it to something lower than 4, that is :) ), which was important when it was made.

Thanks for clearing the spawn thingy up Hobbes :beer:
any chance you also know what the 'flags' do? And the misc1/2 ranks?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


My opinion is that the 'flags' increase the probability of an alien choosing that node. I came up with this after altering the flags to see if the aliens got to upper levels since they seemed to have a tendency to get to ground level. If you examine some UFO maps there seems to be some confirmation of this since some flagged nodes are good ambush positions. But there's no confirmation of this :huh:

The Misc1/2 are even more obscure. They seem to only be used on TFTD, Misc1 on the UFO06 and Grunge2 maps, Misc2 on UFO07 and Grunge14 maps. Since there's no Navigator rank available on the list for TFTD nodes (the UFO Navigator slot is shared with the TFTD Squad Leader) my guess is that they're used to place Navigators or some other type of specific alien. Since the original research tree of TFTD especifically required Lobsterman Navigators to get Magnetic Navigation and they only appeared on specific maps probably that's the reason for the Misc flags.
But again I got no confirmation of any of this. :huh:

#11 x0563511

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 06:59 PM

Well, i got everything working... The proper aliens going around the proper places (my doubledecker light scout)

Only 2 complaints:

If i use any extra tilefiles (like ufo_pods) that the origional doesnt use, they dont show in game, and walking over that spot makes a really odd noise...

If i shoot my ufo down, theres no damage to it! I have 1 and only 1 engine (like the origional - even in the same spot!) but its still intact...

Earlier, i had the engine in a different spot, and a chunk of elerium (pickupable in combat) was sitting where the origional's engine was...


Any suggestions/explanations?

#12 Hobbes

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 08:33 PM

You can only have 5 MCD files assigned to a map, with a total of 255 mcd entries. One of them is automatically assigned to Blanks, so that leaves with 4 four mcds to use. In the case of UFO and Terrain designs the maps are automatically attributed the MCDs (for instance, Roads, Urbits, Urban, Frniture for Urban maps) and even if there's space for it the game engine won't use it.

I can think of a couple of solutions.
1) Redesign the original mcd files to include the tiles you want, discarding the useless ones. The disadvantage is that, since you change the mcd file, the changes will take effect into all the maps that use that mcd file, sometimes requiring you to change all the maps. I've only used this method so far but it works.
2) If you're using XComUtil it's probably possible to change the .cfg file for it to use also the additional xxx.mcd file but I've never tried this and have no idea if it's possible or even advisable to change that part of the settings. You better either read the documentation or ask Scott about it.
3) If the sum of the MCD files for the UFOs doesn't exceed 255 and there's still some room left, you might also replace one of the mcd by a larger one, in order to allow you for the tiles you want. However this would take ages since you'd have to replace the data of an entire mcd file, which might take a while. I'm not sure also if this would work, but it's something I'd like to know if its possible.

The no damage and the Elerium pod inside the engine happen when you use the prompt option on XComUtil. I think it's explained why it happens on the documentation.

#13 DaiShiva

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Posted 01 August 2004 - 12:04 AM

Yeah, i should update that help file some time ^_^

#14 x0563511

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Posted 01 August 2004 - 01:27 PM

maybe put a help file in the help menu? LOL

The thing is, the MCD i want to add is used in a bigger UFO: it uses the same MCDs as the smaller one, plus the ufo_pods file...

And i dont understand the engines not blowing up... xcomutil's random UFOs with random shaps show damage and blown engines...


When im not too lazy im gona hexedit my object data file and stop using xcomutil: all my radars/decoders are acting like small radars - short range, bad detection, no extended info... gettingsick of it. All i want from it is the better heavy laser and high explosives. Seriously, a 25 large radar array is hardly detecting anything!

#15 j'ordos

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Posted 01 August 2004 - 02:14 PM

maybe put a help file in the help menu? LOL

The thing is, the MCD i want to add is used in a bigger UFO: it uses the same MCDs as the smaller one, plus the ufo_pods file...

And i dont understand the engines not blowing up... xcomutil's random UFOs with random shaps show damage and blown engines...


When im not too lazy im gona hexedit my object data file and stop using xcomutil: all my radars/decoders are acting like small radars - short range, bad detection, no extended info... gettingsick of it. All i want from it is the better heavy laser and high explosives. Seriously, a 25 large radar array is hardly detecting anything!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

damage when UFO crashes is completely random I think, sometimes you can get occasions where there is no damage at all, try it out another time :)
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#16 Hobbes

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Posted 01 August 2004 - 02:24 PM

The thing is, the MCD i want to add is used in a bigger UFO: it uses the same MCDs as the smaller one, plus the ufo_pods file...


Either you move that entry you want one of the MCDs used by that map, replacing another entry or you'll have to find a way to get XComUtil to make it work on UFO.
If you want to replace the entry you'll need PCKView to change the image file and MCDEditor to change the tile properties.

Edit: Just had a look at the MCD files used in UFOs. If you're looking for yellow or blue walls you'll need four MCD entries to make it perfect for each one (north and west walls, plus their wrecks), which might be a problem. On the other hand if you only need 1 tile (like the white orb, the alien entertainment pods or a single West/East wall) you could replace one of the blue chairs with it, probably the east facing one since it seems to be the one less used.
Still, this will require you to make a few modifications (deleting the chair on the maps it is used, otherwise the new object will appear on strange places) if you want to run the map with UFO.

Edited by Hobbes, 01 August 2004 - 02:39 PM.


#17 x0563511

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Posted 03 August 2004 - 01:51 AM

Well, i was only hoping to put some of those red pulsing 'fuel' tank like things around, nothing that important..

I tried a bunch of times, the UFO never had any damage...

Im attaching the map and route files zipped so you guys can look at it... First play with the editor

Attached Files


Edited by x0563511, 03 August 2004 - 01:52 AM.


#18 j'ordos

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Posted 03 August 2004 - 12:44 PM

had a look at it in mapview, the nodes on the 2nd floor are a bit odd, is the middle on supposed to just stand there, it doesn't have anywhere to go, and I don't know if the AI can cope with so much objects in the way for the other 4 nodes on that floor. Maybe wrong tho :)
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#19 x0563511

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Posted 03 August 2004 - 12:47 PM

My intention was to make the leader stand there. My reason? Would a leader go out and expose itself? Not in my view... Besides, any rookie opening that door is dead.

Well, im suprised i figured out the node system on my own, i didnt seek help. The enemy didnt seem to have any navigational problems.

#20 Hobbes

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Posted 03 August 2004 - 03:10 PM

My intention was to make the leader stand there. My reason? Would a leader go out and expose itself? Not in my view... Besides, any rookie opening that door is dead.

Well, im suprised i figured out the node system on my own, i didnt seek help. The enemy didnt seem to have any navigational problems.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


The routes seem OK but the Leader node on the normal Large Scout seems to be hardly used in the game. Also it is not connected to any other nodes so the Leader will simply stand there, most likely facing another direction than the doors, an easy kill for the first lucky X-COM rookie who manages to get to the second level. You could probably create another node on the second level inside that room to allow him to move that can also be used by the Navigators.

3) If the sum of the MCD files for the UFOs doesn't exceed 255 and there's still some room left, you might also replace one of the mcd by a larger one, in order to allow you for the tiles you want. However this would take ages since you'd have to replace the data of an entire mcd file, which might take a while. I'm not sure also if this would work, but it's something I'd like to know if its possible


I've got it confirmed: it works. I needed to use the Skyranger tiles for a new 60x60 map I'm building but I couldn't add the .mcd to the list because I already had 5 mcds assigned. So I took the Urbits and Roads .mcds and joined them in the U_Wall02 .mcd. It took me the whole afternoon to change the .pck file and change the data on the .mcd but the editor is accepting it with no problem.
And now I'm creating a Skyranger Factory for UFO2000 :) With elevators :)

Edited by Hobbes, 03 August 2004 - 03:11 PM.


#21 x0563511

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Posted 04 August 2004 - 08:09 AM

:D Awsome! You'll have to slaughter me in it when its done!

The first time i shot my UFO down... There was a leader on that node facing the door.... was i just lucky that he was facing the right way? (I changed the spawn probability to be more common)

I was just thinking.... Ive got an engineering modeling program that i can use to make UFO tiles easily... I can make my own UFO completely from scratch! Can anyone point me somewhere that explains the MCD format and the editors ill need? I probably wont use it anytime soon, but ive can. (Rhinoceros 2.0 if anyone's curious)

#22 j'ordos

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Posted 04 August 2004 - 08:18 AM

:D  Awsome! You'll have to slaughter me in it when its done!

The first time i shot my UFO down... There was a leader on that node facing the door.... was i just lucky that he was facing the right way? (I changed the spawn probability to be more common)

I was just thinking.... Ive got an engineering modeling program that i can use to make UFO tiles easily... I can make my own UFO completely from scratch! Can anyone point me somewhere that explains the MCD format and the editors ill need? I probably wont use it anytime soon, but ive can. (Rhinoceros 2.0 if anyone's curious)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hobbes probably knows about MCD stuff, but bear in mind xcom is limited in colours when you create your own stuff, it's best to use the colours from existing xcom images only. I wonder if anyone has the exact palette...
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#23 x0563511

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Posted 04 August 2004 - 08:23 AM

True... but ill keep the idea in the closet... does UFO2000 use a restricted pallette also?

#24 Blehm 98

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Posted 04 August 2004 - 08:37 AM

:D  Awsome! You'll have to slaughter me in it when its done!

The first time i shot my UFO down... There was a leader on that node facing the door.... was i just lucky that he was facing the right way? (I changed the spawn probability to be more common)

I was just thinking.... Ive got an engineering modeling program that i can use to make UFO tiles easily... I can make my own UFO completely from scratch! Can anyone point me somewhere that explains the MCD format and the editors ill need? I probably wont use it anytime soon, but ive can. (Rhinoceros 2.0 if anyone's curious)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


*clears throat*
no, i wanna go first. i played him in them before anyone else did(beat him once, and he beat me every other time)
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#25 Hobbes

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Posted 04 August 2004 - 08:50 AM

I don't think you can use UFOs in UFO2000. The fact that the Leader was facing the door was luck....the direction of the unit when it spawn is completely random.
There's a link to an MCD Editor in one of the forums of this site, I think (I can't remember where I got it). If you don't find it I can send it to you.
You'll only need the MCD Editor if you want to import particular tiles from one terrain to another or to change their game properties (increase their strength, turn them explosive, etc.)
The MCD file defines the entire characteristics of the tile, namely their type (ground, wall, object), the .pck file it uses, the scang. file (the image when seen on the overhead map), the Line of Fire definitions and several other things).
Regarding the palette, I'd guess that UFO2000 can only use the UFO and TFTD ones. Usually when I want to use TFTD tiles on UFO I use PCKView (see Daishiva's page) to save the .pck as .bmp then import it to the .pck I want. I've also seen both palettes available (try Daishiva's page) to be used by a designing program.

#26 x0563511

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Posted 04 August 2004 - 08:56 AM

blehm... ok, but only if you promise to kick my butt efter he does ^_^

Im not good at all yet, but im improving a little.



Thanks for the information hobbes, ill do a little research.

#27 Twilight Owl

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Posted 05 August 2004 - 04:44 PM

There's a link to an MCD Editor in one of the forums of this site, I think (I can't remember where I got it). If you don't find it I can send it to you.

could you send it to me too please?
Sorry for my English :)

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#28 j'ordos

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Posted 05 August 2004 - 04:49 PM

There's a link to an MCD Editor in one of the forums of this site, I think (I can't remember where I got it). If you don't find it I can send it to you.

could you send it to me too please?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't think there's an MCD editor on this forum, do you mean x-com.co.uk perhaps?
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#29 Hobbes

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Posted 05 August 2004 - 05:17 PM

There's a link to an MCD Editor in one of the forums of this site, I think (I can't remember where I got it). If you don't find it I can send it to you.

could you send it to me too please?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't think there's an MCD editor on this forum, do you mean x-com.co.uk perhaps?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Bagirov posted it on the middle of 10x10 map contest thread.

#30 j'ordos

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Posted 06 August 2004 - 05:06 AM

There's a link to an MCD Editor in one of the forums of this site, I think (I can't remember where I got it). If you don't find it I can send it to you.

could you send it to me too please?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't think there's an MCD editor on this forum, do you mean x-com.co.uk perhaps?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Bagirov posted it on the middle of 10x10 map contest thread.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

aha! I learn every day :) . Thanks!
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#31 Twilight Owl

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Posted 06 August 2004 - 05:11 AM

Bagirov posted it on the middle of 10x10 map contest thread.

thanks for the link
Sorry for my English :)

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